Josheb
Reformed Non-denominational
- Joined
- May 19, 2023
- Messages
- 4,484
- Reaction score
- 1,957
- Points
- 113
- Location
- VA, south of DC
- Faith
- Yes
- Marital status
- Married with adult children
- Politics
- Conservative
This op is intended solely for @justbyfaith. I'd like to start with the example of an atheist, someone who does NOT believe any god or God exists, does NOT believe sin exists, does NOT believe s/he has any need whatsoever to come to any god or God that doesn't exist to address any non-existent God. I'd like to start with a single question and work through one question at a time going from one single question to another single question only when the previous question has been answered. Because responses are not necessarily answers, any question receiving a response that isn't an answer will be asked a second and a third time until an actual answer to the specific question asked is provided. Once a question has been asked three times and remains unanswered that question will be recorded as a question remaining unanswered, either because of inability or unwillingness.
The first question is.....
Is there an example in the Bible of an atheist explicitly stated to ever come to the God denied for salvation from sin that is denied in the power of his own faculties?
If so, then please post the example - either the citation where the passage can be found or a quote of the passage. If no such text exists or is known to exist then answer the question with an immediate, direct, and unqualified, "No."
Notice the use of the words "explicitly" and "stated." The use of those specific words is intentional because I'd like to begin the conversation with what is actually, explicitly stated and not what can be inferred doctrinally. I will address various exegetical inferences later. Doctrinal inferences will come only after what is explicitly stated and what can be exegetically inferred has been addressed. The use of italics, underline, and bold-face type is also intentional and used for multiple purposes, chief of which is to emphasize the importance of starting with what is explicitly stated, but also to serve as a reminder to that effect. Anyone willing to abide by this method can participate but I may or may not reply because I'd like to do this specifically with @justbyfaith and doing so simultaneously with multiple posters makes recording the answers difficult. I trust everyone understands. Your grace is appreciated. Feel free to use the thread to discuss the Q&A among yourselves but, for now, remember this op begins with the atheist.
Why?
Because our doctrine(s) of salvation must account for the person who denies the existence of God and his or her need for anything from the non-existent God. Answering the question, "How does a person get saved?" is not so difficult when we start with someone who already believes in God and already believes in his or her need(s) thereof. The errors of false equivalence and scriptural abuses need to be made clear. Atheist non-believers are not believing believers.
So, again, the one specific question asked is,
Is there an example in the Bible of an atheist explicitly stated to ever come to the God denied for salvation from sin that is denied in the power of his own faculties?
I am aware justbyfaith may currently be suspended. No worries. The op can be engaged when he returns. If any of the mods know the length of any remaining suspension then maybe they can message me and let me know because if he's going to be gone more than 3 days, I'll either delete the op and repost it upon his return or consider taking up the time with other respondents.
.
The first question is.....
Is there an example in the Bible of an atheist explicitly stated to ever come to the God denied for salvation from sin that is denied in the power of his own faculties?
If so, then please post the example - either the citation where the passage can be found or a quote of the passage. If no such text exists or is known to exist then answer the question with an immediate, direct, and unqualified, "No."
Notice the use of the words "explicitly" and "stated." The use of those specific words is intentional because I'd like to begin the conversation with what is actually, explicitly stated and not what can be inferred doctrinally. I will address various exegetical inferences later. Doctrinal inferences will come only after what is explicitly stated and what can be exegetically inferred has been addressed. The use of italics, underline, and bold-face type is also intentional and used for multiple purposes, chief of which is to emphasize the importance of starting with what is explicitly stated, but also to serve as a reminder to that effect. Anyone willing to abide by this method can participate but I may or may not reply because I'd like to do this specifically with @justbyfaith and doing so simultaneously with multiple posters makes recording the answers difficult. I trust everyone understands. Your grace is appreciated. Feel free to use the thread to discuss the Q&A among yourselves but, for now, remember this op begins with the atheist.
Why?
Because our doctrine(s) of salvation must account for the person who denies the existence of God and his or her need for anything from the non-existent God. Answering the question, "How does a person get saved?" is not so difficult when we start with someone who already believes in God and already believes in his or her need(s) thereof. The errors of false equivalence and scriptural abuses need to be made clear. Atheist non-believers are not believing believers.
So, again, the one specific question asked is,
Is there an example in the Bible of an atheist explicitly stated to ever come to the God denied for salvation from sin that is denied in the power of his own faculties?
I am aware justbyfaith may currently be suspended. No worries. The op can be engaged when he returns. If any of the mods know the length of any remaining suspension then maybe they can message me and let me know because if he's going to be gone more than 3 days, I'll either delete the op and repost it upon his return or consider taking up the time with other respondents.
.
