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A Question for the Evolutionist (of any stripe)

Those who hold to evolution are basically accepting the theory of it as being factual, despite no evidence to support it, and the revelation from God in the bible against it as being true
If words still have meaning, yes.
 
How about the Holy Spirit Himself inspired Moses to record truth down to us in the Pentateuch?

Because the people from Adam to Moses had to be able to converse, remember, transmit Gen 1-50. Seriously, do you think they did not know Gen 1-50 until Moses came in 1600 BC--when most of them were long dead? Of course not. Adam nearly overlaps with Noah and his sons nearly overlap with Abraham, which means the custody of the verbal transmission of Gen 1-38 is down to very few people.

The reason for referring to 1-38 is that Joseph is active from 39 on and there is very good evidence that he developed the Hebrew alphabet to work like the Hittite's: not symbols like priests would use, but actual phonics expressions that had an infinite number of ways to be combined and sound together. And there is no record of writing prior. See Malone's THE MOSES CONTROVERSY. Malone will be speaking Fri 21st at 7pm PST at Apologetics Forum of Snohomish County, online, streamed on YT. Sno.Co. is north of Seattle.
 
Fine, I just didn't expect a brag-fest to come of it.

You asked how I came to accept evolutionary processes. I answered by describing the educational path that led there—intellectual exposure, broad reading, and resolving the hermeneutical obstacle in Genesis. That isn't self-promotion, it is just recounting the evidence and study that persuaded me.

An accusation of "bragging" is a deflection, not a critique of what I actually said.
 
There is still NO evolutionary explanation for the very origin of life, though.

And there never will be—because evolution is about the origin of species, not the origin of life. It's right there in the very title of Darwin's book: On the Origin of Species.

Evolution is a biological theory; it presupposes life (biology). No life, no evolution.

There cannot be species changing, as that would require external force to accommodate the required DNA alteration in the basic code itself, which no evolutionary process could perform.

Uh ... what?

Species change all the time. We have empirical evidence of this happening.

It almost sounds as if you imagine DNA is immutable without some "external force." That is scientifically incoherent. DNA changes constantly because the physical processes that produce variation are internal to living systems: replication errors, recombination, mobile genetic elements, spontaneous deamination, copy-number variation, whole genome duplication, etc. Populations accumulate variation with every generation. These are well-characterized biochemical processes and do not require an "external force."

Evolution cannot answer the question on how life originated, nor what is the purpose of our even existing?

Of course it doesn't. It's a scientific theory, not a philosophical worldview.
 
When one performs a "fact check" of evolution against the bible, evolutionism fails—despite what those who believe in what the "science" of evolutionism teach.

[MOD HAT: This is getting dangerously close violating the Rules & Guidelines (e.g., rule 2.2: "Such things as ... misrepresenting, ... are strictly prohibited"). Members should give due diligence to what they write before posting it. And let's make every effort to represent our opponents accurately.]

First, an attempt to fact-check evolution against Scripture would be a category mistake, as the former pertains to natural history and the latter pertains to redemptive history. There is a reason why Scripture doesn't mention the Yangshao, for example, and it's not because they didn't exist. (We know they did.) It's because Scripture has a very specific focus—namely, Christ Jesus. It is the Word of God in written form.

Second, evolutionism is not the scientific theory of evolution; those are two different things, indicated by the obvious suffix "-ism." Evolutionism is not science, it's a philosophical world-view—usually referring to metaphysical naturalism—that is antithetical to biblical Christianity. As Tim Keller noted 15 years ago, "Belief in evolution as a biological process is not the same as belief in evolution as a world-view."

The same science that brings you [evolution] but under a different "occupation" tells us a man who died on a Roman cross ... could not possibly have risen from the dead on day three.

You are conflating two entirely different domains of inference and calling them the same "science." That is a gross misrepresentation, one that I sincerely hope is the product of ignorance. In other words, I hope you're not misrepresenting on purpose (i.e., intentionally misleading).

The disciplines are not parallel. Evolution deals with ordinary, repeatable processes in the created order. The resurrection is a singular, non-repeatable act of divine power. Methodological science deals only with empirical causes, so of course it won't infer a miracle. That is simply a limitation of method. Rejecting a miracle because science cannot describe it would be like rejecting music because mathematics can't hear it.

Ordinary providence governs evolutionary processes. Extraordinary providence governs miracles. Science can describe the former but is methodologically blind to the latter.

If you restrict all explanations to natural causes, then by definition any miracle is excluded before you ever examine the evidence. That isn't science, that is metaphysical naturalism (not to mention question-begging). The same limitation would "rule out" the virgin birth or the exodus. It explains nothing; it simply prohibits the conclusion.

The book of Genesis tells us how mankind fell, received a sin nature, and the need for Christ Jesus to die and resurrect to atone for the sin of mankind.

And that is something that a lot of evolution supporters believe. They are called Christians, most of whom (a) believe what you just said and (b) accept evolution.

Let's represent our opponents accurately and honestly, please.

Yet the same "scientist" claim the resurrection of Jesus didn't happen.

Maybe, but that claim is a philosophical prejudice, not a scientific conclusion—a crucial and significant distinction.

The problem or issue easily becomes, "When did mankind fall into sin? How did mankind fall into sin?"

Since we both think Genesis is pretty clear on that, this is a distraction from the issue.

[The Bible tells us when and how mankind fell], and the theo-evo crowd says, "The Bible doesn't explain how. It couldn't have happened that way, so it but be allegorical."

I am the only member of the "theo-evo crowd" here, so interact with what my claims and arguments assert. Don't gesture vaguely at what some fictional person says.

You even said it in an above reply to @JesusFan.

No, I did not. This is a rule-violation (2.2).
 
Are you referring to God's word?

You seem to be hung up on Judaizers, as you turn each conversation towards them.

Sorry, I don't recall bringing up the question of modern conventional uniformitarianism.

Again, off-topic.

C.S. Lewis believed that biological evolution was compatible with Christianity and that God could have used it as a tool for creation... I don't.

I believe Genesis 1 is true. Don't you?

Yes, the Corinthian material is God's word, sheesh. You have no right to take remarks about the specific issues of a letter(s) and use them for convenience about completely different issues.

The reason there is so much about resistance to Judaizers in the NT is because that is Paul's background, and was the direction that ruined Israel in that generation. Paul was doing everything he could to get his people out from under their bondage. Because his people were supposed to be missionaries to the world (Rom 11).
 
Are you referring to God's word?

You seem to be hung up on Judaizers, as you turn each conversation towards them.

Sorry, I don't recall bringing up the question of modern conventional uniformitarianism.

Again, off-topic.

C.S. Lewis believed that biological evolution was compatible with Christianity and that God could have used it as a tool for creation... I don't.

I believe Genesis 1 is true. Don't you?

What is modern conventional uniformitarianism? Why do you think I mentioned it?
 
Are you referring to God's word?

You seem to be hung up on Judaizers, as you turn each conversation towards them.

Sorry, I don't recall bringing up the question of modern conventional uniformitarianism.

Again, off-topic.

C.S. Lewis believed that biological evolution was compatible with Christianity and that God could have used it as a tool for creation... I don't.

I believe Genesis 1 is true. Don't you?

Since modern conventional uniformitarianism (U'ism) is your POV, it on-topic. You will have to defend it to me. I do not accept it, nor is it Biblical. It is the doctrine that the Huxley's forced Darwin to write after 15 years of his hesitating. They had many issues with Christianity and the idea in the previous generation of belittling Christ and his divinity had been utterly smashed by Rev G Holford's treatment of the prediction of the destruction of Jerusalem. Given that dead-end for skeptics, they turned their effort to cosmology.
 
Are you referring to God's word?

You seem to be hung up on Judaizers, as you turn each conversation towards them.

Sorry, I don't recall bringing up the question of modern conventional uniformitarianism.

Again, off-topic.

C.S. Lewis believed that biological evolution was compatible with Christianity and that God could have used it as a tool for creation... I don't.

I believe Genesis 1 is true. Don't you?


The effort of conventional science to account for long time was a problem for many Christians. In 1905, if you were a fundamentalist, you did not believe the Genesis flood was global, but only about the Caspian sea, because science said so.

No, there is nothing about Gen 1 that suggests such a progression (biological evolution) and 'mutation destroys genetic communication', it does not help it.

Gen 1 is true, but there are cosmological mistakes that are made by operating in English. The colors are quite different in the original. This is seen through word choice and literary style clues. But not in support of biological evolution, only that the 'spreading out' found in Job, Psalms, Isaiah, was an earlier event about the rest of space, very unlike what took place here. I firmly believe that the creative acts on earth were recent, complete, thriving, like Jesus multiplying fish and bread in the gospel narratives. I can show that Day 1's light was clearly the arrival of starlight which provides an interesting timestamp, which I think is inescapable.
 
At that point I stopped reading your post.

Have a nice day.

I find it interesting that someone would rather abandon the discussion than represent their opponent's views accurately. That choice actually says a lot.
 
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