Who will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven?

[makesends]

When is a person saved, technically.

With Scripture?

When elected, from the foundation of the world
At the cross
When regenerated
When forgiven
At his 'arrival' in Heaven

What, 'technically', are you referring to by "saved"?

 

[STAND]

When elected, from the foundation of the world
At the cross
When regenerated
When forgiven
At his 'arrival' in Heaven

What, 'technically', are you referring to by "saved"?

I'm referring to what differentiates those who are unsaved, that God can use, from those who are saved.

Still referencing Matt. 7:21-23

 

[CrowCross]

When is a person saved, technically.

With Scripture?

Hard question to answer...but...When we were dead in our trespasses, we were made us alive together with Christ.
By grace we have been saved through faith. And this is not of own doing.... it is the gift of God.

When are we saved...when God regenerates us. When He gives us the gift of faith and grace.

I imagine it will take much more than 3 sentences to fully answer the question. Some of it will be the biblical facts of what happens while some will be speculative in nature.

For some people it seems to be different timing.

 

[STAND]

Hard question to answer...but...When we were dead in our trespasses, we were made us alive together with Christ.
By grace we have been saved through faith. And this is not of own doing.... it is the gift of God.

When are we saved...when God regenerates us. When He gives us the gift of faith and grace.

I imagine it will take much more than 3 sentences to fully answer the question. Some of it will be the biblical facts of what happens while some will be speculative in nature.

For some people it seems to be different timing.

I would agree ... so doesn't that make it pretty difficult to claim definitively that the people rejected in Matt. 7:21-23 were unsaved?

 

[Eleanor]

Here is a question everyone needs to understand as the scriptures are quite clear....
Who are those who will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven, what descriptions does God use in describing the lost and what will happen to them in the end?
Matthew 5:30
And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
Luke 13:3
I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
Revelation 21:8
But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

So God is clear who the wicked are and what will happen to them..

Psalm 37:20
But the wicked shall perish, and the enemies of the Lord shall be as the fat of lambs: they shall consume; into smoke shall they consume away.

Those to whom the payment for sin has been applied through faith in and trust on the atoning work (blood, Ro 3:25) and person of Jesus Christ for the remission of their sin are the only ones to enter the kingdom of heaven.

 

[Eleanor]

Don't forget Matt. 7:21-23.

These are true believers being rejected.

Hmmm.

But why?

No, these are professing Christians who in spite of their marvelous works did not have converted, believing, submissive, obeying hearts.
They were professors of faith, but not possessors of saving faith.

They were tares, which look a lot like wheat.

 

[Runningman]

Don't forget Matt. 7:21-23.

"...enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of My Father in heaven."
"...depart from Me, you workers of lawlessness!’"

Doing the will of God (The Father) gets someone to heaven. Conversely, being lawless doesn't get someone into heaven. It means unrepentant sinners are not getting very far, if at all, in the door. Therefore, the will of God is to keep the commandments. There are 10 summed up by loving God and our neighbor.

Matt 19
16Just then a man came up to Jesus and inquired, “Teacher, what good thing must I do to obtain eternal life?”

17“Why do you ask Me about what is good?” Jesus replied. “There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, keep the commandments.”

 

[Fred]

"...enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of My Father in heaven."
"...depart from Me, you workers of lawlessness!’"

Doing the will of God (The Father) gets someone to heaven. Conversely, being lawless doesn't get someone into heaven. It means unrepentant sinners are getting very far, if at all, in the door. Therefore, the will of God is to keep the commandments. There are 10.

Matt 19
16Just then a man came up to Jesus and inquired, “Teacher, what good thing must I do to obtain eternal life?”

17“Why do you ask Me about what is good?” Jesus replied. “There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, keep the commandments.”

Which ought to have made the man realize he couldn't for "there is none that doeth good" (Psalm 14:1).

 

[CrowCross]

I would agree ... so doesn't that make it pretty difficult to claim definitively that the people rejected in Matt. 7:21-23 were unsaved?

I would think it is safe to say Jesus knows His sheep and calls them by name. In other words Jesus knows who is saved.

But in the verse Jesus says the following....
23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you workers of lawlessness!’

If they were saved would Jesus say...I NEVER knew you?

 

[Fred]

Who are those who will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven

Those "whose names are not written in The Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world" (Revelation 13:8).

 

[STAND]

I would think it is safe to say Jesus knows His sheep and calls them by name. In other words Jesus knows who is saved.

But in the verse Jesus says the following....
23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you workers of lawlessness!’

If they were saved would Jesus say...I NEVER knew you?

They are professed Christians who never obeyed the Commandments, the Law.

That's how they're workers of iniquity.

Jesus only knows (enters) those who obey.
Jn. 14:21

 

[makesends]

STAND said:
When is a person saved, technically.

With Scripture?

makesends said:
When elected, from the foundation of the world
At the cross
When regenerated
When forgiven
At his 'arrival' in Heaven

What, 'technically', are you referring to by "saved"?

I'm referring to what differentiates those who are unsaved, that God can use, from those who are saved.

Still referencing Matt. 7:21-23

All the above differentiates those who are unsaved from those who are saved, but, curiously, God uses everybody, technically.

But, since you reference Matt 7:21-23 for your question/statement, I will attempt to answer in kind. Matthew talks about those who do the will of God, and I agree he is talking about God's revealed will, as opposed to God's decree. The ability to do as God commands is a result of the work of the Spirit of God in the believer, as much as the obedience itself.

The unsaved cannot obey. Oh, they can comply with what they have understood, but that is not submission. Whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

 

[CrowCross]

They are professed Christians who never obeyed the Commandments, the Law.

Those Christians will stand judgement at the Bema Seat of Christ. This isn't the White Throne.
As being truly saved they will not receive the rewards that they could have received but get in as if the escaped through fire or as some say, by the skin of their teeth.

That's how they're workers of iniquity.

They're workers of iniquity because they believe that by doing such things they have earned their way into heaven.

Jesus only knows (enters) those who obey.
Jn. 14:21

How much obedience is required for Jesus to "know"..."enter"...into a person and consider them saved? Please answer this question.

 

[Hobie]

Are they true believers?

The verse....21“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’23And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’

Were they relying on what they personally did in the Lords name for salvation?

They claim to be Christians, but like the fireman who goes to the fires only because its his job, they care nothing for their fellow man to say nothing of God.

 

[donadams]

Those who reject the grace of baptism

 

[Eleanor]

They claim to be Christians, but like the fireman who goes to the fires only because its his job, they care nothing for their fellow man to say nothing of God.

They did marvelous works, but their hearts were not submissively obedient to God.

 

[Hobie]

"...enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of My Father in heaven."
"...depart from Me, you workers of lawlessness!’"

Doing the will of God (The Father) gets someone to heaven. Conversely, being lawless doesn't get someone into heaven. It means unrepentant sinners are not getting very far, if at all, in the door. Therefore, the will of God is to keep the commandments. There are 10 summed up by loving God and our neighbor.

Matt 19
16Just then a man came up to Jesus and inquired, “Teacher, what good thing must I do to obtain eternal life?”

17“Why do you ask Me about what is good?” Jesus replied. “There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, keep the commandments.”

It is by faith, believing, then the works come, the fruits of the Spirit..

 

[Runningman]

It is by faith, believing, then the works come, the fruits of the Spirit..

People do what are "good works" without faith and also have fruits like love, joy, peace, etc Those things are not directly related to simply having faith, or trusting God.

 

[STAND]

It is by faith, believing, then the works come, the fruits of the Spirit..

Just clarifying: Are you saying that works are the fruits of the Spirit?

I understood the fruits of the Spirit to be characteristics of God listed in Gal. 5:22-23.

Works prove our faith, and faith without works is dead, but aren't the fruits characteristics of the ... soul?

Thinking out loud, I guess.

Not challenging you.

 

[makesends]

People do what are "good works" without faith and also have fruits like love, joy, peace, etc Those things are not directly related to simply having faith, or trusting God.

You see no difference between the reason for the good works, between those without faith and those with faith? Faith itself is different.

One person believes, and even thinks themself to have accepted Christ into their heart. But without the faith the Spirit of God gives, it is a false belief. So with the good works and obedience: Living up to one's conscience, or doing what one thinks they should, and all other aspects of good works have a certain result and reward for this life, but otherwise are useless —compliance is not submission.

"All that is not of faith is sin."