The Tree Of Life - a question

[Carbon]

If Adam and Eve did not sin and remained in a state of perfection, how would all of Adam's descendants, after having populated the entire earth, have survived as well without the tree? There was only one tree, in only one place, and only one of a kind.

 

[prism]

If Adam and Eve did not sin and remained in a state of perfection,

I have a reservation that they were in a state of perfection to begin with, otherwise, they would have obeyed God's warning to begin with.
The rest looks like speculation.

 

[Hobie]

If Adam and Eve did not sin and remained in a state of perfection, how would all of Adam's descendants, after having populated the entire earth, have survived as well without the tree? There was only one tree, in only one place, and only one of a kind.

Same as when the saints get to the kingdom...
Revelation 22:2
In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.

 

[Eleanor]

If Adam and Eve did not sin and remained in a state of perfection, how would all of Adam's descendants, after having populated the entire earth, have survived as well without the tree? There was only one tree, in only one place, and only one of a kind.

We would have inherited his immortality just as we inherit his mortality.

 

[Odë:hgöd]

I have a reservation that they were in a state of perfection to begin with, otherwise, they would
have obeyed God's warning to begin with.

That's likely very true because according to Jas 1:13 God cannot be tempted with
evil. The extent of His sinless perfection is such that there is nothing in evil that
appeals to God. So then, were Adam created with the same degree of sinless
perfection as God's then of course the Serpent would've utterly failed to drag him
down.
_

 

[makesends]

I have a reservation that they were in a state of perfection to begin with, otherwise, they would have obeyed God's warning to begin with.
The rest looks like speculation.

Define what is meant by "perfection". They were, at least, perfectly suited for the purpose to which God intended them.

There is quite a lot to be understood there that we do not. I hear all sorts of 'definitive' statements, and wonder where they come from.

Were they even 'moral' creatures, —'moral' agents, knowing right from wrong— or did they become so by deciding on disobedience?

 

[Eleanor]

Define what is meant by "perfection". They were, at least, perfectly suited for the purpose to which God intended them.

There is quite a lot to be understood there that we do not. I hear all sorts of 'definitive' statements, and wonder where they come from.

Were they even 'moral' creatures, —'moral' agents, knowing right from wrong— or did they become so by deciding on disobedience?

They learned it the hard way. . .

 

[prism]

Define what is meant by "perfection". They were, at least, perfectly suited for the purpose to which God intended them.

I'll define what I mean by perfection if you promise to define, "the purpose to which God intended them.". (The one may answer the other).
By perfection, as I had stated in the OP, if they had been perfect, they would have obeyed God's warning to begin with. @Carbon 's statement assumed perfection; I only questioned it. (And you questioned me? How dare you lol )

 

[makesends]

I'll define what I mean by perfection if you promise to define, "the purpose to which God intended them.". (The one may answer the other).
By perfection, as I had stated in the OP, if they had been perfect, they would have obeyed God's warning to begin with. @Carbon 's statement assumed perfection; I only questioned it. (And you questioned me? How dare you lol )

If that is the definition of perfection, it is a vague definition. You are positing an implication of perfection— something your definition of perfection implies. You're not actually defining it. But that's ok. I don't know that I can define perfection, either, except by THE standard—God himself. Since obviously creatures can't be perfect if they have to be God, then it is referring to lack of something that makes one imperfect, and that would most easily fit, sin. After all, let's say God made them with a tail and fur like an extra intelligent chimp, except, lacking the tail. Would that lack of a tail make them imperfect? What if one arm was built much longer and stronger than the other. Would that be an imperfection?

But my whole point was in the use of the word, "perfection", to describe them. Who said they were perfect? What I read is, "very good". But either way, it seems plain that they were made uncorrupted, as one reads further into the story. And that's the point of the story. Everything we add is speculation, unless it's something Scripture adds, either directly or through reason.

—Oh sorry, "the purpose to which God intended them", is, among many other things, the enslaving of all mankind to sin and thus the need for Redemption.

 

[prism]

If that is the definition of perfection, it is a vague definition. You are positing an implication of perfection— something your definition of perfection implies. You're not actually defining it. But that's ok. I don't know that I can define perfection, either, except by THE standard—God himself. Since obviously creatures can't be perfect if they have to be God, then it is referring to lack of something that makes one imperfect, and that would most easily fit, sin. After all, let's say God made them with a tail and fur like an extra intelligent chimp, except, lacking the tail. Would that lack of a tail make them imperfect? What if one arm was built much longer and stronger than the other. Would that be an imperfection?

But my whole point was in the use of the word, "perfection", to describe them. Who said they were perfect? What I read is, "very good". But either way, it seems plain that they were made uncorrupted, as one reads further into the story. And that's the point of the story. Everything we add is speculation, unless it's something Scripture adds, either directly or through reason.

—Oh sorry, "the purpose to which God intended them", is, among many other things, the enslaving of all mankind to sin and thus the need for Redemption.

YEAH, I'm pretty vague, in this case vague by way of example ( in this case, if the pair were perfect, they wouldn't have disobeyed). Sorry, can I buy you a cup of ?

 

[makesends]

YEAH, I'm pretty vague, in this case vague by way of example ( in this case, if the pair were perfect, they wouldn't have disobeyed). Sorry, can I buy you a cup of ?

I'm just saying, "perfect", IF it does apply to Adam and Eve, AND IF it is about moral perfection, is still only talking about lack of sin nature, or innocence —not about abstaining from disobedience.

 

[prism]

I'm just saying, "perfect", IF it does apply to Adam and Eve, AND IF it is about moral perfection, is still only talking about lack of sin nature, or innocence —not about abstaining from disobedience.

I believe it does pertain to Adam and Eve, otherwise we wouldn't be having this conversation .

 

[makesends]

makesends said:
I'm just saying, "perfect", IF it does apply to Adam and Eve, AND IF it is about moral perfection, is still only talking about lack of sin nature, or innocence —not about abstaining from disobedience.

I believe it does pertain to Adam and Eve, otherwise we wouldn't be having this conversation .

Really.

"Perfect" applies to Adam and Even because we say so?

What word(s) does the Bible use?

But, meanwhile, you didn't respond to what I said, that even IF 'perfect' was the right word, it doesn't mean that they were without ability to sin, as you were indicating earlier.

 

[prism]

I'm just saying, "perfect", IF it does apply to Adam and Eve, AND IF it is about moral perfection, is still only talking about lack of sin nature, or innocence —not about abstaining from disobedience.

It has little to do with the lack of a sin nature, or moral imperfection. I am referring to the potential ability to sin, something we will lack throughout eternity.

Really.

"Perfect" applies to Adam and Even because we say so?

What word(s) does the Bible use?

But, meanwhile, you didn't respond to what I said, that even IF 'perfect' was the right word, it doesn't mean that they were without ability to sin, as you were indicating earlier.

I responded above (in red)

 

[ReverendRV]

If Adam and Eve did not sin and remained in a state of perfection, how would all of Adam's descendants, after having populated the entire earth, have survived as well without the tree? There was only one tree, in only one place, and only one of a kind.

They would have had a Righteous Federal Head, and would have fared very well. Their lives would have been in Adam, through his fulfilled Covenant of Works; and the Life he had when he Ate of the Tree of Life, will be their inheritance...

 

[Hazelelponi]

something we will lack throughout eternity.

Do you think? Dumb question, I know... Lol.

I always saw it that being made perfect we would simply lose all desire to sin, rather than ability itself. But it's likely just 6 of one, half dozen of the other.

 

[ReverendRV]

Do you think? Dumb question, I know... Lol.

I always saw it that being made perfect we would simply lose all desire to sin, rather than ability itself. But it's likely just 6 of one, half dozen of the other.

The Angels of Heaven showed they can Fall; now they know better than to Fall. No fence has been put into place to keep more Angels from Falling; they just learned their Lesson. We will be just as Free to Fall from Heaven, but we'll be Holy and just know better. If we were constrained by God, we would be robots there...

 

[prism]

Do you think? Dumb question, I know... Lol.

I always saw it that being made perfect we would simply lose all desire to sin, rather than ability itself. But it's likely just 6 of one, half dozen of the other.

Good point!
This hinges on the question of whether we could sin in eternity future, if we could, then would not Jesus have to die again? I'll take the six over the half dozen.