THE MODERN-DAY RELIGIOUS FRATERNITY

[TATII]

All of this translates into idolatry, whether practiced by Protestants or Catholics. How in heaven’s name did we ever get this way? Most of the blame may be placed upon the shoulders of the professional clergy. They devise and invent and create and lead and we blindly follow. Are we no longer capable of thinking independently? Where have all the free-thinkers gone? Why have we succumbed to being robots?

Ok…Buff…”how did we ever get this way”…you ask? Here’s my answer…it was always going to be this way. It goes back to Genesis 3:15…it’s the “enmity” [a murderous hatred] between the seed “offspring” of the serpent…which is the “beast”…and the seed “offspring” of the woman which is “Christ”. So essentially and prophetically you can attribute this to God…we see its initial effect shortly after the birth of Cain and Abel…right?

Abel offered to God what pleased God…Cain offered to God what pleased Cain. Cain is rejected by God and his ultimate response was killing his brother…”righteous Abel” as the Lord stated it. My point is…and here is how you stated it Buff…”Most of the blame may be placed upon the shoulders of the professional clergy”…right you are!

However while they are perhaps the “primary tools” that the dragon uses in religion…it works well because these are spiritually manipulated via “lust and pride which creates selfish ambition”…in other words the “world”…via the carnality of the human soul. I see them as merely a “religious version of the world” to be frank.

It does seem like “all” blindly follow…it does not seem as though you are for one…nor am I. The lack of “independent and free thinkers” is due to a demonically inspired deception that convinces people…who are looking for the Lord Yahshua Christ…that the dragon is god and it works…it has always worked.

It works so well because the dragon simply convinces man that he is god…think the serpent in the Garden. “God doesn’t want you to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil because then you will be like God.”

The great apostle Paul told the men of Athens, “I perceive that in every way you are very religious. For as I passed along and observed the objects of your worship, I found also an alter with this inscription, ‘To the unknown god.’ ” It was then that Paul informed them that the authentic God who made the world and everything in it no longer lives “in temples” [structures] “made by man” [Acts 17:22-28].

Men seem to learn but little from history. Moved with pride, swept with unreasoning fears, in every generation there are those who spend their time and money to erect the same idols and to perpetuate the same errors of their sectarian forefathers. There has never been a human idol erected that did not betray God’s trust and eventually bring disaster to its erectors and their idolatrous followers.

Very well “said” Buff…and for what it’s worth…I agree…thank you for your post and a chance to engage and respond.

Tatwo...

 

[TATII]

If you have been following me, you should know that "church" is a total mistranslation of the Greek ekklesia. For if ekklesia renders "church," there was one under Moses. [See King James' Acts 7:38.]

I am following you bro...

So true…I have followed the origins of this word “church” back to its beginning…it is actually pagan. The earliest use that I could find is “Circe” also spelt Kirké and is pronounced like “shursh”…”she” is a powerful sorceress and goddess in Greek mythology with an exceptional talent for “mixing drugs.” I am sure she works right along with “pharmakeia”…and reportedly she was the daughter of the sun god Helios…of course.

“Church” is not what the Lord Yahshua is building up at all…no…He is raising up the “sons of God” and any of those...who are in “her”...the “church”…the “harlot church” are being called out…in fact one day perhaps not so far from now there will be a “last call.”

Jesus founded one body of believers [Eph. 4:4], a redeemed community, a congregation of saints. But not once did He found a "church." For if He did, which one among the hundreds of denominations did He establish? All of these denominations are divisive religious parties/sects. Yet God has children among most of them.

A very necessary truth and…well said…and this is not just words on a forum…it is a prophetic call and warning to not be deceived in this day and hour…find the Holy Spirit and when you do…you will learn of the Lord for the end of the age.

Tatwo...

 

[TATII]

Greetings donadams,
You stated…

Isa 22:21-22 father (pope means papa) with key of authority over the kingdom

Matt 16:16-19 Peter declared blessed, head of the church (on earth) key (signs) of jurisdictional authority

Matt 17:27 It is Jesus Christ who identifies peter with himself.

Jn 21:17 Peter entrusted with the flock or church

Acts 15:7 God chose Peter


Acts 4:8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Ghost, said unto them, Ye rulers of the people, and elders of Israel,

3rd time for Peter to receive “spirit baptism”! He must be special for some reason! Jn 20:22 acts 2:4

I’ll agree with you that Peter was “blessed”…and that he was given “jurisdictional authority” but that will be the extent of our agreement…here’s why…and I think you should understand this. There is only “One Head” of the “church” as you call it…whether “on earth or in heaven”…and it was and is neither…Peter nor any other man…that is pure blasphemy.

Christ Yahshua is the “plenary authority”…in other words He is the “source of all authority in heaven and on the earth” and you know that. What Peter and the other apostles received was “delegated authority” to manage or direct the affairs of the Lord on earth. That is how the Lord directs His house or Kingdom on earth yet today…I think you understand that. Now let’s look at the scripture passage you cited…shall we? Have you ever really dug into this on your own Donadams?

“Now when Jesus came into the district of Caesarea Philippi, He was asking His disciples, "Who do people say that the Son of Man is?" (14) And they said, "Some say John the Baptist; and others, Elijah; but still others, Jeremiah, or one of the prophets." (15) He *said to them, "But who do you say that I am?" (16) Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God."

Peters response “you are the Christ, the Son of the living God” here…is profound for two reasons…one…Peter is stating that he…”Peter” can now see the Lord Yahshua Christ as He really is…and that is as “God manifest in the flesh”…Peter is now utterly aware that the “Spirit of God and Father of creation” is standing before him clothed in flesh…likely a first for Peter in that very moment. The second reason is found in the Lords subsequent response to him in vs. 17

(17) And Jesus said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.

“Flesh and blood did not reveal this to you Peter”…this is a “Spirit breathed revelation directly from God the Father”…and it is in this…that Peter experienced something he had maybe never experienced prior…the Spirit of God spoke into Peters spirit…looking right into Peter at a deeply experiential level…He said…I am right here Peter…the Lord you are looking at and talking to…I AM God.

What Peter in fact was saying to the Lord Yahshua and the rest of the disciples is…”this in fact is the eternal God robed in the flesh…the promised Messiah…walking with me…talking with me…living with me...because He just told me that”…and we know that this is true because of what the Lord says to Peter in the next verse.

(18) "I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it.

Peter says in vs. 15…”I know who you are…you’re my God…walking as a man…like me”…and the Lord said “that’s right Peter…and I see you Peter…I know who you are as well.”

Now the “rock” that the Lord speaks of here…is…the pure spiritual revelation of whom “HE IS”…in other words the “Spirit of God revealed authentication” from the Father Himself…to Peter of who the Lord Yahshua Christ “IS”…“That is the rock” in which the Lord will build His Body. It is upon the Holy Spirit revealed “Truth”…to the spirit of man…that Yahshua Christ is the Lord God Almighty...living in them.

Clearly in the entirety of scripture there is only “One Rock” upon which man may stand in eternity…and that is none other than the “only begotten of the Father”…the “Son in whom the Father is well pleased”…the “Rock of our salvation”…the Lord Yahshua Christ. It most assuredly is not Peter…nor “any other man” as you well know.

Additionally going along with the “Rock” being the only access to the Father…meaning being reconciled to God…is that the Son of God was manifest to destroy the works of the dragon…hence the reference to the gates of hell being unable to stop the move of the Kingdom of God.

(19) "I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven."

Now…as the “Royal Priest of the Kingdom of heaven”…meaning both its “Eternally enthroned King and reigning High Priest”…He has “all the keys” as he stated…let me explain briefly these keys…if you will…and this includes the “power to bind and loose on earth and in heaven.” They are described as…"when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. (14) "He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you. (15) "All things that the Father has are Mine; therefore I said that He takes of Mine and will disclose it to you.” John 16:14-15

The “Keys” that are spoken of…is the Holy Spirit…He is that “eternal life” living in men individually and speaking to them directly...that can only be found in Christ…who has become the Holy Spirit indwelling His people…again…He’s the only Rock.

(20) Then He warned the disciples that they should tell no one that He was the Christ.” Mat 16:13-20 NASB

Of course He warned them…for sure...Peter…and maybe some others there…and perhaps all of them…may now be completely aware of whom Yahshua really is…He is the Eternal God and Everlasting Father of creation robed in flesh. If they go about broadcasting that…at that time…their lives would have been in danger from the religious Law keepers and Judaizers just as the Lord Himself was.

Tatwo...

 

[donadams]

Greetings donadams,
You stated…

I’ll agree with you that Peter was “blessed”…and that he was given “jurisdictional authority” but that will be the extent of our agreement…here’s why…and I think you should understand this. There is only “One Head” of the “church” as you call it…whether “on earth or in heaven”…and it was and is neither…Peter nor any other man…that is pure blasphemy.

Christ Yahshua is the “plenary authority”…in other words He is the “source of all authority in heaven and on the earth” and you know that. What Peter and the other apostles received was “delegated authority” to manage or direct the affairs of the Lord on earth. That is how the Lord directs His house or Kingdom on earth yet today…I think you understand that. Now let’s look at the scripture passage you cited…shall we? Have you ever really dug into this on your own Donadams?

“Now when Jesus came into the district of Caesarea Philippi, He was asking His disciples, "Who do people say that the Son of Man is?" (14) And they said, "Some say John the Baptist; and others, Elijah; but still others, Jeremiah, or one of the prophets." (15) He *said to them, "But who do you say that I am?" (16) Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God."

Peters response “you are the Christ, the Son of the living God” here…is profound for two reasons…one…Peter is stating that he…”Peter” can now see the Lord Yahshua Christ as He really is…and that is as “God manifest in the flesh”…Peter is now utterly aware that the “Spirit of God and Father of creation” is standing before him clothed in flesh…likely a first for Peter in that very moment. The second reason is found in the Lords subsequent response to him in vs. 17

(17) And Jesus said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.

“Flesh and blood did not reveal this to you Peter”…this is a “Spirit breathed revelation directly from God the Father”…and it is in this…that Peter experienced something he had maybe never experienced prior…the Spirit of God spoke into Peters spirit…looking right into Peter at a deeply experiential level…He said…I am right here Peter…the Lord you are looking at and talking to…I AM God.

What Peter in fact was saying to the Lord Yahshua and the rest of the disciples is…”this in fact is the eternal God robed in the flesh…the promised Messiah…walking with me…talking with me…living with me...because He just told me that”…and we know that this is true because of what the Lord says to Peter in the next verse.

(18) "I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it.

Peter says in vs. 15…”I know who you are…you’re my God…walking as a man…like me”…and the Lord said “that’s right Peter…and I see you Peter…I know who you are as well.”

Now the “rock” that the Lord speaks of here…is…the pure spiritual revelation of whom “HE IS”…in other words the “Spirit of God revealed authentication” from the Father Himself…to Peter of who the Lord Yahshua Christ “IS”…“That is the rock” in which the Lord will build His Body. It is upon the Holy Spirit revealed “Truth”…to the spirit of man…that Yahshua Christ is the Lord God Almighty...living in them.

Clearly in the entirety of scripture there is only “One Rock” upon which man may stand in eternity…and that is none other than the “only begotten of the Father”…the “Son in whom the Father is well pleased”…the “Rock of our salvation”…the Lord Yahshua Christ. It most assuredly is not Peter…nor “any other man” as you well know.

Additionally going along with the “Rock” being the only access to the Father…meaning being reconciled to God…is that the Son of God was manifest to destroy the works of the dragon…hence the reference to the gates of hell being unable to stop the move of the Kingdom of God.

(19) "I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven."

Now…as the “Royal Priest of the Kingdom of heaven”…meaning both its “Eternally enthroned King and reigning High Priest”…He has “all the keys” as he stated…let me explain briefly these keys…if you will…and this includes the “power to bind and loose on earth and in heaven.” They are described as…"when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. (14) "He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you. (15) "All things that the Father has are Mine; therefore I said that He takes of Mine and will disclose it to you.” John 16:14-15

The “Keys” that are spoken of…is the Holy Spirit…He is that “eternal life” living in men individually and speaking to them directly...that can only be found in Christ…who has become the Holy Spirit indwelling His people…again…He’s the only Rock.

(20) Then He warned the disciples that they should tell no one that He was the Christ.” Mat 16:13-20 NASB

Of course He warned them…for sure...Peter…and maybe some others there…and perhaps all of them…may now be completely aware of whom Yahshua really is…He is the Eternal God and Everlasting Father of creation robed in flesh. If they go about broadcasting that…at that time…their lives would have been in danger from the religious Law keepers and Judaizers just as the Lord Himself was.

Tatwo...

One thing at a time please

Yes Christ is the only head of the apostolic church that He established, but He ascended to heaven and named Peter as acting head here on earth!

God chose Peter acts 15:7

 

[donadams]

Greetings donadams,
You stated…

I’ll agree with you that Peter was “blessed”…and that he was given “jurisdictional authority” but that will be the extent of our agreement…here’s why…and I think you should understand this. There is only “One Head” of the “church” as you call it…whether “on earth or in heaven”…and it was and is neither…Peter nor any other man…that is pure blasphemy.

Christ Yahshua is the “plenary authority”…in other words He is the “source of all authority in heaven and on the earth” and you know that. What Peter and the other apostles received was “delegated authority” to manage or direct the affairs of the Lord on earth. That is how the Lord directs His house or Kingdom on earth yet today…I think you understand that. Now let’s look at the scripture passage you cited…shall we? Have you ever really dug into this on your own Donadams?

“Now when Jesus came into the district of Caesarea Philippi, He was asking His disciples, "Who do people say that the Son of Man is?" (14) And they said, "Some say John the Baptist; and others, Elijah; but still others, Jeremiah, or one of the prophets." (15) He *said to them, "But who do you say that I am?" (16) Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God."

Peters response “you are the Christ, the Son of the living God” here…is profound for two reasons…one…Peter is stating that he…”Peter” can now see the Lord Yahshua Christ as He really is…and that is as “God manifest in the flesh”…Peter is now utterly aware that the “Spirit of God and Father of creation” is standing before him clothed in flesh…likely a first for Peter in that very moment. The second reason is found in the Lords subsequent response to him in vs. 17

(17) And Jesus said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.

“Flesh and blood did not reveal this to you Peter”…this is a “Spirit breathed revelation directly from God the Father”…and it is in this…that Peter experienced something he had maybe never experienced prior…the Spirit of God spoke into Peters spirit…looking right into Peter at a deeply experiential level…He said…I am right here Peter…the Lord you are looking at and talking to…I AM God.

What Peter in fact was saying to the Lord Yahshua and the rest of the disciples is…”this in fact is the eternal God robed in the flesh…the promised Messiah…walking with me…talking with me…living with me...because He just told me that”…and we know that this is true because of what the Lord says to Peter in the next verse.

(18) "I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it.

Peter says in vs. 15…”I know who you are…you’re my God…walking as a man…like me”…and the Lord said “that’s right Peter…and I see you Peter…I know who you are as well.”

Now the “rock” that the Lord speaks of here…is…the pure spiritual revelation of whom “HE IS”…in other words the “Spirit of God revealed authentication” from the Father Himself…to Peter of who the Lord Yahshua Christ “IS”…“That is the rock” in which the Lord will build His Body. It is upon the Holy Spirit revealed “Truth”…to the spirit of man…that Yahshua Christ is the Lord God Almighty...living in them.

Clearly in the entirety of scripture there is only “One Rock” upon which man may stand in eternity…and that is none other than the “only begotten of the Father”…the “Son in whom the Father is well pleased”…the “Rock of our salvation”…the Lord Yahshua Christ. It most assuredly is not Peter…nor “any other man” as you well know.

Additionally going along with the “Rock” being the only access to the Father…meaning being reconciled to God…is that the Son of God was manifest to destroy the works of the dragon…hence the reference to the gates of hell being unable to stop the move of the Kingdom of God.

(19) "I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven."

Now…as the “Royal Priest of the Kingdom of heaven”…meaning both its “Eternally enthroned King and reigning High Priest”…He has “all the keys” as he stated…let me explain briefly these keys…if you will…and this includes the “power to bind and loose on earth and in heaven.” They are described as…"when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. (14) "He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you. (15) "All things that the Father has are Mine; therefore I said that He takes of Mine and will disclose it to you.” John 16:14-15

The “Keys” that are spoken of…is the Holy Spirit…He is that “eternal life” living in men individually and speaking to them directly...that can only be found in Christ…who has become the Holy Spirit indwelling His people…again…He’s the only Rock.

(20) Then He warned the disciples that they should tell no one that He was the Christ.” Mat 16:13-20 NASB

Of course He warned them…for sure...Peter…and maybe some others there…and perhaps all of them…may now be completely aware of whom Yahshua really is…He is the Eternal God and Everlasting Father of creation robed in flesh. If they go about broadcasting that…at that time…their lives would have been in danger from the religious Law keepers and Judaizers just as the Lord Himself was.

Tatwo...

Yes Jesus is the rock of salvation but Christ builds his church on the person of peter and the apostles eph 2:20

1 pet 2:25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

No reason to give the person of Peter the keys of the kingdom, “Thee outward sign” of jurisdictional authority if not to govern and administer the kingdom until Christ returns in glory!

To be the chief pastor and teacher of the faithful!

Matt 16:17-19
Why is Peter even mentioned?
Why does Jesus change His name?
Why does Jesus say Peter is blessed?
Why does Jesus give Peter the keys of the kingdom (jurisdictional authority)
Why does Jesus give Peter power to bind and loose?
Why does scripture say God chose Peter? Acts 15:7
What does Peter standing up signify? Acts 1:15 & 15:7


Matt 16:17
Jesus declares Peter’s person not confession to be blessed!

Peter is the rock chosen by God!

Peter’s person is blessed and chosen not Peter’s confession?

Peter’s person has the keys of jurisdictional authority!

Acts 15:7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

God chose Peter!

Thanks

 

[TATII]

Yes Christ is the only head of the apostolic church that He established, but He ascended to heaven and named Peter as acting head here on earth!

Ok so donadams...

I read all your posts on the forum thoroughly...something has jumped out at me donadams...I'll give you this...even though scripture does not explicitly say so...anywhere. Circumstantially...perhaps...Peter may have been "acting head of the church on earth"...for around 50 days...that is...in as much...as he was the one to introduce the "Lord Yahshua Christ back to the earth" as the "Holy Spirit of the living God" who was poured out "upon the earth" that following Pentecost after His resurrection...Him who at that point...is most definitely back on earth in His Body as its Head!

For anyone who does not believe and understand this...seek the Lord Yahshua Christ because you need Him now. If you have questions lets talk.

Tatwo...