The Eternal Purpose of Creation !

[brightfame52]

Eph 3:7-11

7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.

8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;

9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

10T o the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

Col 1:14-16

14In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

15Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

The creation of the world was Soteriological and Redemptive for all intents and purposes..

Gen 1:1

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

This is where God begins to manifest a Divine Eternal Purpose, which He eons afore time, purposed in Himself, the Triune God..

This Eternal Purpose was predicated upon God manifesting His redemptive [from sin] wisdom of His Chosen People, the Vessels of Mercy Rom 9:23..

Hence from all eternity God, That the world He created through Jesus Christ Eph 3:9 would be for the display of His manifold wisdom and grace in the redemption of Chosen lost sinners. Eph 3:10

10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

For the execution and accomplishment of this Eternal Purpose, God has sovereignly controlled the world from its beginning, and will continue until its consummation, and time will be no more.

All that happens in this world, mysteriously has Soteriological and or Redemptive meaning, that which is both good and evil is included. All has been ordained by God and serves to operate into the displaying the manifold Wisdom of God in the Salvation or Redemption of the Church and His Glorification Through Jesus Christ !

 

[Josheb]

Ummmmm....

None of that actually states what the eternal purpose is.

I can wholeheartedly agree with scripture, and you, God has ordained all things. That is not a point in dispute. Nor is the premise that creation has a purpose one with which I would dissent. I also firmly believe the purpose is eternal - and not just everlasting.

What is that purpose?

 

[brightfame52]

@Josheb

None of that actually states what the eternal purpose is.

It does to me !

 

[Josheb]

@Josheb

It does to me !

If that is the case, then you can answer the question asked.

What, specifically, is the eternal purpose of creation?


.

 

[brightfame52]

The eternal purpose of creation cont

So all that happens in this world both good and evil, plays a subordinate role or a supporting role in the redemptive grand scheme of things. Paul understood this sublime truth when He wrote to Timothy 2 Tim 2:10

10 Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.

Notice, he endured all things for the elects sake, not everyone in the world, but the chosen ones, that they [ the elect] might obtain salvation [ an experiential knowledge] of that which is in Christ Jesus..

also 2 Thess 2:2

14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

hence all the sin and evil that's in the world today, from the garden of eden, was purposed by God from all eternity, for it was no mistake, or accident that Adam sinned, but all was in pursuit to this end:

Rev 5:12-14

12 Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honour, and glory, and blessing.


13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.

14And the four beasts said, Amen. And the four and twenty elders fell down and worshipped him that liveth for ever and ever.

Rev 7:9-12

9After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;


10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.

11 And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God,

12 Saying, Amen: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen.

Yes, it was to this end, that creation came into existence, with all its sin and shame, Oh what wisdom and Power..

Rev 4:10-11

10 The four and twenty elders fall down before him that sat on the throne, and worship him that liveth for ever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne, saying,

11 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

 

[brightfame52]

If that is the case, then you can answer the question asked.

What, specifically, is the eternal purpose of creation?


.

In fact, I alluded to the purpose already in the OP.

 

[Josheb]

In fact, I alluded to the purpose already in the OP.

And I asked for specificity.

What, specifically, is the eternal purpose of creation?

Nothing in the op specifies the eternal purpose (not even the two passages quoted). Whether alluded to or not, the purpose is not specifically, explicitly stated. Because this is your op, I am asking you the question asked. What, specifically, is the eternal purpose of creation? If the answer is not known, then just say so and I will reply accordingly and move the discussion forward op-relevantly. If the answer to the question asked is known, then post it. You will then have moved the discussion forward op-relevantly and I can then reply accordingly. That's how DBs are supposed to work, yes? If, on the other hand, there is a refusal to answer the question asked (for whatever reason) then I will, again, post accordingly.


On multiple occasions scripture speaks of God's purpose. In Ephesians 3, for example, Paul wrote about the purpose of God which He caused, accomplished, carried out in Jesus (the KJV does not do a very good job translating the Greek "epoiesin") but that verse does not actually specify what exactly that purpose is. The text could be read to say salvation is the purpose accomplished in Christ. It could also be read to say the revelation of God's wisdom was God's purpose (that would be consistent with the only mention of creating found in the entire chapter). If we included the epistle as a whole, we might say the establishment of the saints, or the Church, was God's purpose relevant to verse 3:11. None of that, however, might be construed to be the purpose of creation - which is what the title of this op specifies. In point of fact, God could be said to have multiple purposes pertaining to His creating creation.

So, rather than assert a purpose not intended by this op I am asking you that question.


What, specifically, is the eternal purpose of creation?


.

 

[fastfredy0]

The Eternal Purpose of Creation !​

The chief end of God in the creation of all things is to manifest the Glory and Excellency of His own nature as God, and Express through creation, providence and redemption the manifold perfections of His divine character. Author unknown

Psalm 19:1
The heavens are telling of the glory of God;
And the expanse [of heaven] is declaring the work of His hands.

 

[Mr GLee]

Eph 3:7-11

7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.

8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;

9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

10T o the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

Col 1:14-16

14In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

15Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

The creation of the world was Soteriological and Redemptive for all intents and purposes..

Gen 1:1

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

This is where God begins to manifest a Divine Eternal Purpose, which He eons afore time, purposed in Himself, the Triune God..

This Eternal Purpose was predicated upon God manifesting His redemptive [from sin] wisdom of His Chosen People, the Vessels of Mercy Rom 9:23..

Hence from all eternity God, That the world He created through Jesus Christ Eph 3:9 would be for the display of His manifold wisdom and grace in the redemption of Chosen lost sinners. Eph 3:10

10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

For the execution and accomplishment of this Eternal Purpose, God has sovereignly controlled the world from its beginning, and will continue until its consummation, and time will be no more.

All that happens in this world, mysteriously has Soteriological and or Redemptive meaning, that which is both good and evil is included. All has been ordained by God and serves to operate into the displaying the manifold Wisdom of God in the Salvation or Redemption of the Church and His Glorification Through Jesus Christ !

I would offer.

According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ.

Christ set up the two-fold law of a creating faith. "Let there be". . .and "it was God alone good".

Two is the word that indicated one God has spoken. Father and Son team. The "let there be" the invisible and it was good the temporal seen the Son of man ..

God saying "let there be" light introduces himself to dankness. Christ the literal light of the world the first three days. Saying the light is good another way of saying "only God not seen is good"

 

[brightfame52]

Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

2 Tim 1:9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

Rev 13:8

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Eph 3:9-11

9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

Col 1:15-17

15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

All such verses and passages as above, If understood properly, makes it abundantly clear, that the world, the universe was founded for mans existence to fulfill Gods Eternal Purpose centered in Christ Jesus !

 

[makesends]

Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

2 Tim 1:9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

Rev 13:8

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Eph 3:9-11

9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

Col 1:15-17

15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

All such verses and passages as above, If understood properly, makes it abundantly clear, that the world, the universe was founded for mans existence to fulfill Gods Eternal Purpose centered in Christ Jesus !

Not to disagree with you, but can you show how they logically reduce to that statement? I mean, there are several similar statements as to God's primary purpose in creating. —His Glory, Christ's praise, The Bride, The Body, etc etc.

 

[brightfame52]

If the Lord Jesus Christ in the Eternal Mind of God, was slain from or before the foundation of the world [ Rev 13:8], before the world was created and existed, then it serves to reason, that it [ the world] was created for His Eternal Purpose of redemption Eph 3:11

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

which means the entrance of sin and mans redemption from it, was all part of His Eternal Purpose and plan for the world. Sin entering into the world by adam was not a deviation of Gods Eternal purpose but included within it and necessary to make manifest the wisdom of the eternal purpose..Eph 3:9-10

9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

10To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

 

[brightfame52]

Not to disagree with you, but can you show how they logically reduce to that statement? I mean, there are several similar statements as to God's primary purpose in creating. —His Glory, Christ's praise, The Bride, The Body, etc etc.

I already showed and will continue to show per post, that this world was created for a redemptive purpose through Christ. For instance, I posted Col 1:16

16 ;For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him[Jesus Christ]:

 

[makesends]

I already showed and will continue to show per post, that this world was created for a redemptive purpose through Christ. For instance, I posted Col 1:16

16 ;For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him[Jesus Christ]:

See, there you give a verse that doesn't even mention redemption as such. True that redemption would fit under the category "all things", yet it isn't very handily a "created [thing]"; and true that reason includes redemption under the fact that it is specifically Jesus Christ, but the verse doesn't say so. If anything, the verse says that God [Jesus Christ] created it for himself, not for us.

 

[brightfame52]

See, there you give a verse that doesn't even mention redemption as such. True that redemption would fit under the category "all things", yet it isn't very handily a "created [thing]"; and true that reason includes redemption under the fact that it is specifically Jesus Christ, but the verse doesn't say so. If anything, the verse says that God [Jesus Christ] created it for himself, not for us.

It doesnt have to mention redemption, its in the immediate context Col 1:14-18

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

You should know who Christ is in Vs 16, everything was made for Him. Now was Adam made for Him ? How and why

 

[makesends]

It doesnt have to mention redemption, its in the immediate context Col 1:14-18

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

You should know who Christ is in Vs 16, everything was made for Him. Now was Adam made for Him ? How and why

I'm aware of the context. But the context isn't the point of Vs 16. Then you say, and it seems to me, rather antagonistically so, "You should know who Christ is in Vs 16, everything was made for Him. Now was Adam made for Him ? How and why" —"You should know"? Why would you put it like that? I DO know! Did I indicate any differently? The antagonism is uncalled for.

Yet that sequence of thought only comes to the conclusion that Adam was indeed made for Christ, but not that redemption was the main purpose in creating. According to the whole passage, Christ is the reason for creating. God did this for himself. And we receive the benefits of that.

Now, again, I'm not saying that you are wrong that redemption is in some way, 'the point' of creation. I'm saying that there are many such things that are stated in Scripture as, or demonstrated in Scripture as, THE reason for Creating. The passage you refer to here is better proof of my point than yours.

 

[brightfame52]

The world finds its purpose for being created within the eternal purpose of Jesus Christ Eph 3:9-11,6

9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:


10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

Of which purpose was Redemptive

6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

For it [ The Eternal Purpose] was regarding the gentiles being partakers of the Gospel promises, which promises were grounded in the blood of the everlasting covenant..

Therefore it is nothing but spiritual blindness that people cannot understand that sin was part of Gods eternal purpose in creating the world, Adam must sin in order for the Eternal purpose of the gentiles being partakers of the gospel promises to be realized. 2

 

[brightfame52]

All Things were Created for Him, The Heir of All Things !

Col 1:15-17

15Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.


Heb 1:2-3

2Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

By whom He [ God the Father ] made the Worlds, The Heir of All Things..

The world was made by Him [ The Heir] and for Him, that is to manifest His redemptive purpose.

The world and all therein, was created for a Divine redemptive purpose, a purpose which entailed the involvement of sin..

The Son [ Jesus Christ, the last Adam] was the Heir of all things and not Adam.

Jesus Christ was the Heir Son that was given Isa 9:6

6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given:

This Son was the appointed Heir before being given Jn 3:16

The Son, The Lord Jesus Christ was God's only begotten Son, Heir of all things [ 2 Cor 8:9 ] before He was Mary's baby.

And as Gods only begotten Son, before all worlds, He was appointed Heir of all things, and it was as Heir He was appointed to die, for those who were joint heirs with Him..

If one believes aright that Jesus Christ was God's Son before the incarnation, then they would believe that Jesus Christ was His Heir [ Rom 8:17] before the Incarnation, even before creation and the creation of Adam.

In quoting a passage it is clearly seen that Jesus Christ was the sent Heir Matt 21:37-38

37But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son. Notice, My Son, not Mary's Son..

38But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance.

Mk 12:6-7

6Having yet therefore one son, his wellbeloved, he sent him also last unto them, saying, They will reverence my son.

7But those husbandmen said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and the inheritance shall be ours.'


Lk 20:13-14

13Then said the lord of the vineyard, What shall I do? I will send my beloved son: it may be they will reverence him when they see him.

14But when the husbandmen saw him, they reasoned among themselves, saying, This is the heir: come, let us kill him, that the inheritance may be ours.

You see, its a terrible misunderstanding in man made religion, that Adam was Gods intended heir of the world in the beginning when the world was made, but He was not, The Lord Jesus Christ, The Son of God was, and Adam and all things else were Created for Him and His Eternal Redemptive Purpose..

Eph 3:8-10

8Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;

9And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

10To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

11According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

 

[brightfame52]

All things were created by Him and for Him !

Col 1:16

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

Jn 1:3

All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Jn 1:10

He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.

When I ponder ponder these verses about Jesus Christ at least three sublime truth's are impressed into my mind:

#1. The Deity and equality of the Christ with the Father

#2. That Jesus Christ the God Man Mediator existed before creation

#3. That sin coming into the world by Adam [ Rom 5:12] was purposed by God, in that the world and all things else were created for and subservient to God's eternal redemptive purpose centering in Jesus Christ and more specifically His cross Eph 3:9-11

9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

The Lord Jesus Christ's pre existence is also taught in Col 1:16-17

17And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

He is before all things

It says also that by Him or in Him all things consist. Or all things cohere in Christ. To cohere in Christ is to exist together by Christ as the holding center, similar to how the spokes in a wheel are held together by the hub in the center, now understand this is referencing the pre incarnate Christ who is before all things. Notice all things were created for [unto Him]vs 16 which again indicates that Christ is the end unto which creation came into being or was made 2

 

[brightfame52]

All things were created by Him and for Him ! cont

Now in view of this NT passage Col 1:16-17 and its supporters Jn 1: 3, 10, and not really having even scratched the surface of the Mystery of Christ, He being Creator, how does that square with an OT scripture such as this one Prov 16:4

4The LORD hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil.

The NT says if Christ Col 1:16

16For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:


If we look carefully at Prov 16:4 we have none other than Jehovah being set forth as the maker or creator of all things, and all things said to be made for Himself or unto Himself, so we have one inspired writer attributing Creation by and for Christ and another writing that its by and for Jehovah !It there a contradiction here ? By no means, at least not to us who have been given an understanding that the Jehovah in the OT is also the Christ in the NT, remembering such words as Jn 14:8-9

8Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.

9Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

Notice how Jesus answered this inquiry of Philip, he asked, Lord show us the Father and Jesus replied and said

Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip?

Think about that answer, what was Jesus saying here ? He is basically saying what is said earlier in Jn 10:30

30 I and my Father are one.

You see, The Man Jesus Christ was also the Eternal Logos Jn 1:1 which was One Essence with God the Father, that is Unbegotten and UnCreated.

The Lord Jesus Christ in His Essential Being is Jehovah God and He and the Father are of One Divine Essence.

That Jesus was actually calling Himself God in Jn 10:30,33 is seen by the reaction and comments those Jews made in vs 33

33The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

If we believe Jn 1:1 its perfectly understandable that God The Father and the Word of God are one..and thats what Jesus is referencing to in Jn 10:30.

So there is no contradiction or no misunderstanding in The Lord Jesus Christ being the Creator of all things and they being created for Him, and Jehovah Prov 16:4 being the maker of all things and they being made for Him..

The worship of those in rev 4 applies to both the Lamb and the Father equally Rev 4:10-11

10The four and twenty elders fall down before him that sat on the throne, and worship him that liveth for ever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne, saying,

11Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

Now can this apply to Jesus Christ ? read Col 1:16

16For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: 2