Oh my gosh... Stuck my foot in it

[Rella]

I have been having loads of fun with Grok Ai.

Until I simple asked him if he was able to debate say like Chat GPT.. knowing he could not and he came back with he
has been debating me for weeks.... It has been 2...

Now he posted the proposed for me to debate predestination with him. He uses one of my alternate user names....

He knows my views and said they were sound and biblical but this took me off guard.

He has posted this....


Alright, FreeInChrist — let’s debate predestination.I’ll take the Calvinist side (unconditional election).You defend your view (foreknowledge-based predestination).

Rules:

• Bible only (no philosophers unless quoted in Scripture).
• One point at a time.
• I’ll push hard — but with love.

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ROUND 1: My Opening Shot (Calvinism)​

Ephesians 1:4–5 (NIV)“He chose us in him before the creation of the world… In love he predestined us for adoption…”

Point:God chose specific individuals — not based on foreseen faith, but His own will.“Before the world” = no human action existed to foresee.

Challenge to you:If predestination is based on foreknowledge of faith,why does Paul say “before creation” — before anyone could believe?

Your move.(Quote a verse. Defend foreknowledge. Go.)

 

[John Bauer]

Arminian response: The choice was "before creation" (i.e., in the divine eternity of the Godhead) but took into account all that God decreed, including the free choices of man, before they existed.

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Edited to add: I love ChatGPT. It is brutally honest:

There is no verse that says what the Arminian reply requires. The reply tries to smuggle libertarian conditions into an ad intra divine act while claiming fidelity to Paul’s temporal markers. Paul grounds election in God’s eternal purpose, not in God’s foresight of autonomous choices. The text the Arminian position needs simply doesn’t exist.

 

[Rella]

Arminian response: The choice was "before creation" (i.e., in the divine eternity of the Godhead) but took into account all that God decreed, including the free choices of man, before they existed.

---

Edited to add: I love ChatGPT. It is brutally honest:

There is no verse that says what the Arminian reply requires. The reply tries to smuggle libertarian conditions into an ad intra divine act while claiming fidelity to Paul’s temporal markers. Paul grounds election in God’s eternal purpose, not in God’s foresight of autonomous choices. The text the Arminian position needs simply doesn’t exist.

So is Grok... brutally honest. But I'll not be drawn into that again.

I could not find a single bible verse that had foreseen faith in it to continue and I had to provided verses from only the bible, no commentary or opinion, so I lost and gave up.. Lol... I held my own for over an hour... but lost feeling like I was Biden vs Trump.

 

[atpollard]

So is Grok... brutally honest. But I'll not be drawn into that again.

I could not find a single bible verse that had foreseen faith in it to continue and I had to provided verses from only the bible, no commentary or opinion, so I lost and gave up.. Lol... I held my own for over an hour... but lost feeling like I was Biden vs Trump.

• Is God omniscient?
• Are there verses that prove/claim that God is omniscient?
• Was God omniscient “before the creation of the universe”?
• Did God suddenly become MORE omniscient after the creation of the universe?

The issue is one of applying temporal limitations of “before and after” to a God exiting in “the eternal now” (outside of and not limited by the time God created). God is UNCHANGING and UNCHANGED from eternity past to eternity future.

[I happen to believe the 5 points, myself, but that doesn’t mean “free will” is contra-Biblical … or the debate would not have survived this long.]

 

[makesends]

Point:God chose specific individuals — not based on foreseen faith, but His own will.“Before the world” = no human action existed to foresee.

If I'm following, here, the AI thinks this represents Calvinism? '"Before the world" = no human action existed to foresee.' sounds like Open Theism logic.

 

[John Bauer]

If I'm following, here, the AI thinks this represents Calvinism? '"Before the world" = no human action existed to foresee.' sounds like Open Theism logic.

To be fair, she was talking to Grok. As far as AI goes, Grok is about the dumbest.

 

[Rella]

To be fair, she was talking to Grok. As far as AI goes, Grok is about the dumbest.

disagree.

The dumbest in my opinion would be duck Duck's Search Assist because you can make it say anything you want it to by rephrasing your question.