NEW TOPIC! Covenant and How It Helps With Interpretation

[Arial]

There are two major structures used in Bible interpretation: covenant and dispensations. I add a third for humor's sake, though unfortunately it may be more common than either of the other two, except when it comes to Revelation,where it becomes dispensationalist. That of willy nilly. Believing that the Bible is inerrant and therefore is a unity, but never taking any effort to making sure the interpretation is treated as though it were part of a unity or making sure that the interpretation does not contradict any other part of scripture.

Both of the main two are building blocks or a framework around which interpretations are arrived at. The first keeps the Bible unified as to redemption, starting with the covenant of redemption within the Godhead before creation, keeping all that follows consistent within a covenant relationship. Biblical covenant is a relationship between the covenant maker---always God----and that which He covenants with. In His covenant with mankind, it is a personal relationship as both God and man made in His image and likeness, are personal relational beings, and man was created by God for such a relationship.

Covenant theology keeps this covenantal frame work that began with creation flowing steadily through the entire Bible with no breaks or separations in that covenant of redemption, which was not only with mankind, but with the creation itself and all that is in it. It is His covenant with all of His creation that we tend to divorce from, or neglect in our interpretations, from the covenant of redemption. We focus instead solely on the redemption of mankind.

In dispensationalism, the covenants are not denied but the building blocks become dispensations---four to seven depending on which branch of the theology is used. These dispensations are God dealing in different ways with mankind. They are in this theology, innocence,conscience, human government, promise, Law, Church, Kingdom. Within the interpretation of these dispensations is a great deal of disconnect and division from the covenant of redemption itself. And from redemption. It sets the Kingdom age as a literal thousand year reign with the returned Jesus sitting on the throne in Jerusalem, the animal sacrifices reinstated, as God redeems and fulfills all the promises to the nation/state of Israel made in the OT. The believing saints are in heaven, including all Gentile believers, waiting. It keeps Israel and the other nations divided, has two redemptive plans through the same means---Christ---alienates God from His covenant with all creation until the final outcome of restoration. (I realize that not all dispensationalist have identical views, and so there are some who will disagree with what was stated. It is not the intention of this thread to delve into all the nuances of Dispensational theology but rather to show the contrast and results when covenant is the framework of Bible interpretation.)

In following posts I will lay out the covenant view.

To be continued.

 

[CrowCross]

There are two major structures used in Bible interpretation: covenant and dispensations. I add a third for humor's sake, though unfortunately it may be more common than either of the other two, except when it comes to Revelation,where it becomes dispensationalist. That of willy nilly. Believing that the Bible is inerrant and therefore is a unity, but never taking any effort to making sure the interpretation is treated as though it were part of a unity or making sure that the interpretation does not contradict any other part of scripture.

Both of the main two are building blocks or a framework around which interpretations are arrived at. The first keeps the Bible unified as to redemption, starting with the covenant of redemption within the Godhead before creation, keeping all that follows consistent within a covenant relationship. Biblical covenant is a relationship between the covenant maker---always God----and that which He covenants with. In His covenant with mankind, it is a personal relationship as both God and man made in His image and likeness, are personal relational beings, and man was created by God for such a relationship.

Covenant theology keeps this covenantal frame work that began with creation flowing steadily through the entire Bible with no breaks or separations in that covenant of redemption, which was not only with mankind, but with the creation itself and all that is in it. It is His covenant with all of His creation that we tend to divorce from, or neglect in our interpretations, from the covenant of redemption. We focus instead solely on the redemption of mankind.

In dispensationalism, the covenants are not denied but the building blocks become dispensations---four to seven depending on which branch of the theology is used. These dispensations are God dealing in different ways with mankind. They are in this theology, innocence,conscience, human government, promise, Law, Church, Kingdom. Within the interpretation of these dispensations is a great deal of disconnect and division from the covenant of redemption itself. And from redemption. It sets the Kingdom age as a literal thousand year reign with the returned Jesus sitting on the throne in Jerusalem, the animal sacrifices reinstated, as God redeems and fulfills all the promises to the nation/state of Israel made in the OT. The believing saints are in heaven, including all Gentile believers, waiting. It keeps Israel and the other nations divided, has two redemptive plans through the same means---Christ---alienates God from His covenant with all creation until the final outcome of restoration. (I realize that not all dispensationalist have identical views, and so there are some who will disagree with what was stated. It is not the intention of this thread to delve into all the nuances of Dispensational theology but rather to show the contrast and results when covenant is the framework of Bible interpretation.)

In following posts I will lay out the covenant view.

To be continued.

Through out the years I have seen argument..debates, call them what you will...about the meaning of the terms...covenant and dispensation...I'm glad to see you are adding definitions to your points.

In my view I see the sacrifices being reinstated by the Jews...performed in the "rebuilt Temple" which occurs in the "Jacobs trouble" tribulation dispensation in the future.....but the sacrifices won't be recognized by God. At the end of the tribulations I see a literal 1,000 year time span where Jesus rules with Satan being released again at the end of the 1,000 years. But prior to all of that, the rapture of the Church.

 

[Arial]

Through out the years I have seen argument..debates, call them what you will...about the meaning of the terms...covenant and dispensation...I'm glad to see you are adding definitions to your points.

In my view I see the sacrifices being reinstated by the Jews...performed in the "rebuilt Temple" which occurs in the "Jacobs trouble" tribulation dispensation in the future.....but the sacrifices won't be recognized by God. At the end of the tribulations I see a literal 1,000 year time span where Jesus rules with Satan being released again at the end of the 1,000 years. But prior to all of that, the rapture of the Church.

That of course, is a dispensational view. But let's continue with where the covenant interpretive view leads and how it gets there. That is not a statement by me of one being right, the other wrong, though naturally I find the covenant way more consistent with the whole of redemption. The reader can decide for themselves---also a given, but with the covenant side presented. If a person is dispensationalist, they already have the content of that side. Others may just be curious or see what might have been seen but not considered in the whole. In any case, it is meant to build up and not tear down.

 

[Arial]

OP cont.

First we must establish that a covenant existed with God and His creation. This requires that we establish what constitutes a covenant. It defines a relationship between the greater and the lesser, with the greater giving all the promises for which he is responsible and the obligations on those in the relationship, and the consequences for covenant breaking, which the covenant maker activates should the covenant be broken, and takes upon himself if he fails in any of the covenant promises.

Since God is the covenant maker in the Bible, and He is the one and only creator, there already exists even before creation, a covenant relationship, not just with mankind, but with the cosmos, with all that He creates, to do what He assigns it to do. He provides everything necessary for their compliance and supplies every need of all He creates.

First He created light and light and darkness separated day from night. Then He separated the waters from the waters, then the waters from the land. He called to the earth to sprout vegetation, plants yielding seed, fruit trees bearing fruit with seed, and the earth obeyed.

He assigned the lights in the expanse their positions and their purpose. (Gen 1:14-19)

He commanded the waters that He created to swarm with living creatures, and the heavens with winged birds, assigning their place, and commanded them to multiply, and it was so. (Gen 1:20-23)

In Gen 1:24-25 He created all the other animals on the earth and commanded them to multiply, each after its own kind. And so it was.

All these things continue to this day. The living creatures keep to the covenantal relationship God has with His creation by instinct, and cannot be covenant breakers because God is the one who holds all things together and in whom and for whom all things exist. It is a covenant of grace.

Next we will come to the unique creature, man, and observe the covenant relationship God has with him.

 

[CrowCross]

That of course, is a dispensational view. But let's continue with where the covenant interpretive view leads and how it gets there. That is not a statement by me of one being right, the other wrong, though naturally I find the covenant way more consistent with the whole of redemption. The reader can decide for themselves---also a given, but with the covenant side presented. If a person is dispensationalist, they already have the content of that side. Others may just be curious or see what might have been seen but not considered in the whole. In any case, it is meant to build up and not tear down.

Keeping in mind salvation has always been by faith...alone. No matter when in human history...pre-flood, post flood, times of the law, time of grace...whenever.

I've heard from some of those who don't like dispensations do not like it because they believe that dispensationalist say God used a different style or kind of redemption in each dispensation.

 

[Arial]

Keeping in mind salvation has always been by faith...alone. No matter when in human history...pre-flood, post flood, times of the law, time of grace...whenever.

I've heard from some of those who don't like dispensations do not like it because they believe that dispensationalist say God used a different style or kind of redemption in each dispensation.

That is the point I will get to. There is really only one covenant, the covenant of redemption. It is in all the other distinctive covenants, with distinctive boundaries. The SInai, with Noah, Abraham, David.

 

[Arial]

OP cont.
The creation of mankind in Adam is unique in that it is the only creature created in the image and likeness of God. One of the things Adam, and therefore mankind, was entrusted with as this image bearer was to have dominion over everything in creation. But not to do with as he pleased. Man was put in the position of mediator of the creation between God and His creation. It was not a position of domineering dominance, but as dominance according to the will of the Creator. Man was the steward of the earth and all that was in it. He was to do so in accordance with the very character of the one whose image he bore. The earth was a kingdom of God, and man also was to multiply and cover the earth with this kingdom. That is a covenant relationship. The lesser with responsible obligation to the greater and obligation on the greater to the lesser.

It is often called a covenant of works in contrast to a covenant of grace, and I have done so myself. And indeed, there were the works of rightly being obedient to God in carrying out the works of stewardship. But it is also a covenant of grace. Neither man nor plant nor animal receives anything from God but by His grace. He has never owed anyone anything and He never will. It is grace when He says in Gen 1:29-30 And God said, "Behold, I have given you every plant yielding seed that is on the face of all the earth, and every tree with seed in its fruit. You shall have them for food. And to every beast of the earth and to every bird of the heavens and to everything that creeps on the earth, everything that has breath of life, I have given every green plant for food."

There was not a drop of blood meant to be shed in God's creation.

It was grace and covenant boundary when God said ""You may surely eat of every tree of the garden, but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die."

Another covenant relationship was established for man when God created Eve. The human to human covenant relationship of marriage and family.

Adam and Eve broke the covenant relationship, which in essence is God dwelling with us. He walked in the Garden with them. It was the meeting place, the tabernacle, of God with man. As a result Adam and all his progeny became the same as him in nature. Covenant breakers. We break our covenant with God and our responsibility to His creation. This is why in Romans 8:20-21 we see that it is God who subjected the creation to futility. For the creation waits with eager longing for the revealing of the sons of God. For creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of him who subjected it, in hope that the creation itself will be set free from its bondage to corruption and obtain the freedom of the glory of the children of God.

Among other things, came the first bloodshed for atonement for sin, and pre incarnation, the animals paid that price, temporary though it was, insufficient for redemption, though it was. But what is of most importance here to note and remember is that God the covenant of redemption is not only about us, but all of creation.

As catastrophic as the fall of Adam and Eve was in the damage it wrought, the greatest of which was that all mankind was born dead in trespasses and sins, the first promise of redemption is given when God curses the serpent. "I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and her offspring; he shall bruise you head, and you shall bruise his heel."

Keep your eye on the seed as we continue. The covenant of redemption progresses from this point, but it never wavers from it. It is not only in the designated covenants, it is the purpose of them and it is present in everything that follows in the Bible, and the purpose of everything that follows.

 

[Arial]

OPcont.

I will pause for just a moment to make an observation.

We tend unwittingly (and some wittingly)to see God in two opposing ways. A God who is loving and a God who is full of vengeance and wrath. A God who is love who also hates. Or the wittingly in essence have God changing. He is one way in the OT and became another way in the NT, no matter that His wrath still hangs over the heads of the unbelieving.

God cannot be perfectly righteous unless He also judges unrighteousness. He cannot be love unless hates what is not good.

 

[Arial]

Keeping in mind salvation has always been by faith...alone. No matter when in human history...pre-flood, post flood, times of the law, time of grace...whenever.

Salvation has always been through faith, yes, but it is by grace of election.

 

[Arial]

OP cont.

In Gen 6:9-22 we have the account of Noah and the flood. God elects Noah and his descendants to save. Noah was in the line of Seth. From Noah's son Shem, came Abraham. From Abraham Isaac; from Isaac, Jacob. from Jacob, Judah; from Judah, David; from David, Jesus, the promised Seed. This is important for in it we see in all God's actions are the central purpose of preserving the promised Seed that would crush the serpent's head----way back at the beginning. So we have made known to us, the goal and the way of redemption, in the very first recorded covenantal relationship between God and His creation. And this does not only concern mankind, but everything in His creation that has the breath of life, and all created things, but through mankind.

I want us to see clearly here how important it is to not neglect this, as though mankind is the only one that has God's attention, and that we are His only concern. As though everything else in creation is incidental, even though every bit of it displays His glory, and power, and perfection, and sovereignty. Not to mention His faithfulness and trustworthiness. If we begin to recognize this, the other thing that becomes evident is just how radical our fall was, and the magnitude and love and sacrifice it will take for grace and grace alone, to rescue us for Himself, and in so doing, restore the entire creation and created order to perfect peace. We must never forget, as we tend to, that we too are creatures. The fact that we are unique creatures in that we were created in the image and the likeness of the Creator, does not remove our existence as a creature.

One way to see that is to pay attention to something I would guess most of us find abhorrent, but that became the temporary covering for our sins against a holy God. Bloodshed. Abel offered a sacrifice to God of blood, taking life. Cain shed the first (we must assume because of what is given in the Scripture) drop of blood against another human. What we see, even before the Sinai covenant is blood shed as a substitute. One life for another. And it is the animals that pay that tremendous price. All those bulls and rams and goats and birds, were not nothing to God. They did not serve as a substitute of temporary appeasement because they were nothing. Not just the animals paid the price for our treason, but all of creation did. Through man came destruction. Through man must come redemption and restoration.

In the Noahic covenant, the first thing we see, as we see in everything from Day One, if we are paying attention, is election of who He will save. Though the Gen account says that Noah was blameless, or righteous, and we tend to see that as why God chose him and his family, biblically that cannot be the case. If we believe what is told us in Romans by Paul, concerning the condition of all men who are born in Adam (which is everyone), Noah may have sinned less and in less horrific ways than those around him, though it does not say anything about the condition of his sons or their wives, Noah could not have been utterly blameless. He chose Noah and his descendants for His own purpose, and that purpose was the ultimate redemption in Christ. Noah's son Shem was the Seed bearer. And not only mankind was saved out of the waters, but so too were two of every kind of animal.

Before the flood when God commanded Noah to build the ark He said to Noah, Gen 6:13 "I am going to put an end to all people, for the earth is filled with violence because of them. I am surely going to destroy both them and the earth."

When the flood waters receded and dry land appeared, in Gen 8 God gives the same command that He gave to Adam. 15-17 "Come out of the ark, you and your wife and sons and their wives. Bring out every kind of living creature that is with you---the birds, the animals, and all the creatures that move along the ground---so they can multiply on the earth and be fruitful and increase in number on it." Noah was given the same stewardship over creation as Adam was, and that mankind still has. That covenant responsibility never went away.

In Gen 9:1-17 we see things altered in creation from the way in which they were created, because of our fall, God subjecting all creation to futility as we see in Romans, but man's responsibility as steward was not. And God makes a covenant with mankind and creation, a covenant of grace---a promise to never destroy all life. It is in this covenant that we see what is known in theology as common grace.

 

[Arial]

Addition to post #10, concerning Noah. It is of note that though God saved Noah and his family from the flood,and through the flood, He did not save any of them from themselves. Though the Seed who is Christ remained, so too did the seed of Adam. God says even though, man is wicked, He will never again destroy all life.

 

[Arial]

OP cont.

In Gen 11 we find the account of the tower of Babel. Gen 11:4 "Let us build ourselves a city,and a tower with its tip in the heavens, and let us make a name for ourselves; otherwise we shall be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth." This is the opposite of what God commissioned Adam and then Noah, to do.

Not only that but it was a common practice in the ancient Near East to build a city as a walled enclosure for safety, with a stair tower designed to reach to the realm of the gods, so the people could ascend to the gods, and the gods could descend to the earth. What they wanted was fame, and what they feared, was being scattered without the security of numbers. Instead of filling the earth as commanded they intended to concentrate themselves in one location. To make a name for themselves. They were shaking their fist at God.

Which reminds me of something I heard several years ago. I do not know it it is true or not. The Titanic was said to be indestructible and unsinkable. On its first oceanic launch, it is said, the man responsible for the design stood and shook his fist at the sky and defied God to be able to sink her.

God simply did this---- "the Lord scattered them abroad from there over the face of all the earth, and they left off building the city. Therefore it was called Babel, because that the Lord confused the language of all the earth;and from there the Lord scattered them abroad over the face of all the earth. (Gen11:8-9)

This was a judgement to be sure, but it was also a means of redemption. It was what God had always intended for the express purpose of redeeming men all over the whole world. It is no coincidence that the Jews, through whom Christ would come, too were scattered abroad.

We should remember this as we move forward. The Israelites had come to think of themselves as exclusive to God and God exclusive to themselves. The borders were greater than a city, but they were also meant to be a means of redemption going to all the world. It is interesting, the position of Canaan, the land they were to inherit, is not particularly hospitable, but it is a crossroads of travel and commerce.

 

[Arial]

OP cont: Abraham

Here, more than any other place in the Bible, the Covenant and DIspensation frame works part ways. In Dispensation theology, the covenant made with Abraham largely focuses on the land, (national geographic Israel) and ethnicity (descendants of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob). A sharp distinction is made between Israel and the rest of the world, as though that were God's ultimate purpose in choosing Israel as His people. The rest of the covenant promise is neglected which is the very part that presents His purpose in choosing one nation. The blessing of all nations through the seed of Abraham. That only comes into play with the advent, death, and resurrection of Christ, but national, geographic, ethnic, Israel, still remains separate from the Gentile world in redemption, whereas the NT makes clear that it is not.

It is because DIspensation theology has not considered the covenant with Adam and Eve and creation itself, which leads to the covenant made with Noah and creation again; it is because of a failure to treat the Bible as one continuous story and it's covenantal structure (how God relates to mankind, and mankind's position as covenant mediator over creation; his responsibility to God as that mediator; the damage over all creation that his failure to obey caused; and God's unbroken work of redemption from the curse and promise of the Seed of Gen 3 onward, that causes this division. His work, is, in Dispensationalism, brought forth through divisions of the ways in which He deals with mankind. It is, in fact, man centered.

In covenant theology, there is no division between one thing and the next, but one covenant with creation, including mankind and through mankind, of redemption. A covenant that promises the seed of the woman will crush the serpent's head. That Seed was in Seth, son of Adam, it was in Noah, it was in Abraham, it was in Judah, it was in David, it IS Christ.

The land given as Israel to the sons of Jacob, and His promise to be their God, was not ethnically based, and it was never intended that they should always be separate from the rest of the world, a small isolated kingdom of God amidst the whole world. But that they should become a light to the Gentiles---the rest of the world. DIspensation theology clings to the same misconception that Israel itself came to have, and that by the time of the arrival of the Seed, was entrenched. That they, by being biological descendants of Abraham, were the only people of God. By Christ's day they had become so exclusive that they added to God's law in the matter, to not even eat with a Gentile or enter their house, or offer help to even one who was only half Jewish, A Samaritan.

When in the OT the Israelites believed that they could even break God's law because the fact that they had it, and came from the loins of Abraham, made them God's people; when they failed in their mission to be a witness of God to the world outside their borders, God did to them exactly what He did with the tower of Babel, and those who walled themselves off for the sake of making a name for themselves. He scattered them far and wide. No one and nothing would stop Him from redeeming His creation through the Seed, and doing it His way.

And there they were, when Christ died on the cross and was raised from the dead, and ascended back to the Father. And there they were in Jerusalem at Pentecost when they heard the good news in the language they had learned in these other lands, and 3000 believed, and carried this good news back to their homes in Gentile lands.

 

[makesends]

I add a third for humor's sake, though unfortunately it may be more common than either of the other two, except when it comes to Revelation,where it becomes dispensationalist. That of willy nilly. Believing that the Bible is inerrant and therefore is a unity, but never taking any effort to making sure the interpretation is treated as though it were part of a unity or making sure that the interpretation does not contradict any other part of scripture.

Unfortunately, you are right. It is more common. Few take the time to study for themselves long enough to even notice the contradictions. They follow someone, or some method, or some view.

An example, not from soteriology, but... a new believer in my church, on fire for the Lord, having been informed that HIS decision is what made the difference, has all the affirmation he needs from his personal experience...