First Rule of Bible Hermeneutics: Simple Enough to Teach a Child

[Arial]

I might have the wrong list but it starts with ‘the NT interprets the OT’ and gets more particular from there. Very helpful.

I might have had a Present Truth list in mind.

I did read the four points of hermeneutics but in a skimming way. They are saying the same things as presented here but with more detail. My own depiction of hermeneutics is "Who, what, where, when, why." That comes from having been involved with journalism and the newspaper business way back when. We were taught to cover all those points when writing an article, and do it in the first paragraph. I don't know if they even still teach it to journalism students.

 

[makesends]

I read it like a novel. I literally get the light right and curl up and just start reading. I let God speak to me through the word and the Holy Spirit.

But I'm not as good at meticulous study I don't think. Everything I do is bulk reading.

Should I do more meticulous study? I guess I'm about to regardless with the institutes starting Saturday, as we are making a study group out of it.

Do people have positive habits they can get into or thoughts on what kind of study habits we should be in?

There's a time for everything. Some of my best times alone with the Lord have been when I was in distress over my sinfulness, or with trying to understand something I was going through in life, and read voraciously, many chapters at a sitting, sometimes whole books. I started seeing repetition of themes, and cross references that don't show up in any cross-reference notation I've seen. Seeing God's heart in his words, all the way through, his purity and hatred at sin, his loving plan for his own, and his joy in his work, and so many other things in keeping with who he is, omnipotent and unchanging.

None of us is as meticulous as we would like to think we are. We just don't have the time. Worse yet, some who are meticulous are so enthralled with their own thinking that they don't even know their meticulous study was done with a goal in mind or proving what they already think. Others doing meticulous study are so enamored of some new thing they learn, that their sense of proportion goes all out of whack. Nevertheless, it is important and necessary.

But we do check out what we reasonably can, particularly in keeping with the immediate context, and then, as we get to know and read the Bible, and begin to understand some of the commentary of passages by those who have done meticulous study, we learn.

 

[EarlyActs]

NT interps OT

Letters interp gospels

Complete doctrinal sections interp incidental
References

Ordinary-stated sections interp symbolic

 

[Mr GLee]

In Bible Hermeneutics we first find the meaning of a passage, and having done that, we can move on to its application to us as Christians.

Let's look at one passage as an example. Jeremiah 29:11 "For I know the plans I have for you," declares the Lord, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future."

I would offer.

Not a salvation issue.

Find First meaning. . avoid the spiritual gospel meaning of Christ?

The first step in finding the unseen spiritual understanding or hermeneutics, The wisdom of God, hid from those whose foundation is "out of sight out of mind" They have no unseen eternal understnding called powerful faith (God calls them fools)

The loving commandment that informs the believer "Without parables Christ spoke not" as the prescription needed to rightly divide the parables

The first work of any Bible study slow down dig a little, do a little pearl hunting.

Mark it on their right hand, or in their forehead: Don't waste the eternal prescription

2 Corinthians 4:181;While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

,
l

 

[Arial]

Not a salvation issue.

That particular passage in Jer 29:11 is not a salvational issue and I never presented it as one. The subject of the OP is hermeneutics. And the failure to use the laws of hermeneutics in determining the meaning of a passage certainly can become a salvational issue. It is why, for instance, there are religions claiming to be Christian that deny the divinity of Jesus. And if his divinity is denied, that is, his eternal existence as being with God and being God, then one is basing their salvation on a lie, a completely different Jesus than the one seen by proper hermeneutics applied to interpretation.

Find First meaning. . avoid the spiritual gospel meaning of Christ?

Interesting comment from someone who apparently spiritualizes everything in the Bible. Christ is a person, God incarnate and Son of man--come as one of us for the purpose of redemption.

The first step in finding the unseen spiritual understanding or hermeneutics, The wisdom of God, hid from those whose foundation is "out of sight out of mind" They have no unseen eternal understnding called powerful faith (God calls them fools)

Hermeneutics is a science and art of Bible interpretation. A science because it follows set rules. An art because it takes careful application. It has nothing to do with "unseen spiritual understanding" and is not defined as "unseen spiritual understanding". The first step to understanding anything in the Bible is "Who is God?" It is his book, his word.

The loving commandment that informs the believer "Without parables Christ spoke not" as the prescription needed to rightly divide the parables

The passage that says "Without parable Christ spoke not" is in reference to that particular set of teachings and the way Jesus was teaching in that particular instance. It cannot mean that everything he said was a parable because most of what he said was not a parable. (Hermeneutic priniciples of context and non-contradiction.

The first work of any Bible study slow down dig a little, do a little pearl hunting.

The first work of Bible study is "Who is God?". Everything must stay plumb to who he is. That is what makes a pearl a pearl.

 

[Mr GLee]

That particular passage in Jer 29:11 is not a salvational issue and I never presented it as one. The subject of the OP is hermeneutics. And the failure to use the laws of hermeneutics in determining the meaning of a passage certainly can become a salvational issue. It is why, for instance, there are religions claiming to be Christian that deny the divinity of Jesus. And if his divinity is denied, that is, his eternal existence as being with God and being God, then one is basing their salvation on a lie, a completely different Jesus than the one seen by proper hermeneutics applied to interpretation

Thanks

Find the first meaning idea would seem to oppose the wonderful law that without parables Christ spoke not. the gospel from Satan.

The interpreting instructions (2 Corinthians 4:18) are to compare the temporal historical to the unseen eternal spiritual. Not only historically true but spiritually Eternal mixed with temporal .

Interesting comment from someone who apparently spiritualizes everything in the Bible. Christ is a person, God incarnate and Son of man--come as one of us for the purpose of redemption.

Carnal like in re-incarnation applies to the flesh the temporal dying. Not incarnation but rather resurrection new creature. Flesh and blood cannot enter new order. It returns to dust

The word person applies to face to face what you see is what you get

Because God has no form (person) we can miraculously see him face to face is the revealed gospel Called faith (the unseen things. . to the same unseen eternal faith to faith same as face to face

Shadows a ceremonial sign to the world of the good things to come to represent invisible Christ. The di nothing to the users as carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.

2 Corinthians 4:6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Romans 1:12-17 That is, that I may be comforted together with you by the mutual faith (Christ in us) both of you and me.;Now I would not have you ignorant, brethren, that oftentimes I purposed to come unto you, (but was let hitherto,) that I might have some fruit among you also, even as among other Gentiles.;I am debtor both to the Greeks, and to the Barbarians; both to the wise, and to the unwise. So, as much as in me is, I am ready to preach the gospel to you that are at Rome also.;For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.;For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith (Christ) to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. . . . ..(Emanuel's )

The first work of Bible study is "Who is God?". Everything must stay plumb to who he is. That is what makes a pearl a pearl.

Amen

How would you define the word parable when it comes to scripture the spiritual understanding?

 

[mailmandan]

I am a firm believer in properly harmonizing scripture with scripture before reaching our conclusion on doctrine.

 

[Arial]

Find the first meaning idea would seem to oppose the wonderful law that without parables Christ spoke not. the gospel from Satan.

All right, you need to quit saying things like this. We have been patient with you and you ignore everything that is said to you. Also, it in no way addresses the post it is responding to and quotes. Both are rules violations.

The interpreting instructions (2 Corinthians 4:18) are to compare the temporal historical to the unseen eternal spiritual. Not only historically true but spiritually Eternal mixed with temporal .

Give a proper exegesis of the scripture. Don't just use it and use it incorrectly according to your own imagining.

Carnal like in re-incarnation applies to the flesh the temporal dying. Not incarnation but rather resurrection new creature. Flesh and blood cannot enter new order. It returns to dust

Jesus was not reincarnated. No one is. Stop saying things like this. And if you cannot help saying them at least attempt to support your blasphemy with a well rounded exegesis of scripture. Our patience is running thin.

The word person applies to face to face

Then check out John 1:1 In the beginning was God and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The Greek word translated "with" in that passage is nuanced in the Greek as face to face.

Because God has no form (person) we can miraculously see him face to face is the revealed gospel Called faith (the unseen things. . to the same unseen eternal faith to faith same as face to face

"Faith to faith" does not mean "face to face". And broaden your understanding of "person". It is more than a human. It designates a type of being as personal. What that means is it is an entity that relates to and interacts with things. In the case of God, it means that he is a being that speaks and acts, creates and governs that creation, and by his own initiative and doing has a personal relationship with humanity.

Shadows a ceremonial sign to the world of the good things to come to represent invisible Christ. The di nothing to the users as carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.

Total nonsensical statement.

How would you define the word parable when it comes to scripture the spiritual understanding?

Parable is a noun and as such has its own definition. It does not have a definition "when it comes to Scripture the spiritual understanding".

The definition of parable is: A usually short fictitious story that illustrates a moral attitude or a religious principle. A comparison; a similitude; specifically, a short fictitious narrative of something which might really occur in life or nature, by means of which a moral is drawn.

Therefore, not everything in the Bible is a parable as you frequently suggest, and not everything Jesus taught was a parable. If it were, none of it would be actually true it would just be a comparison of something that might be true or could be true. When he taught in parables it was to blind the eyes of those that did not belong to him, and open the eyes of those who were his.

 

[Arial]

I am a firm believer in properly harmonizing scripture with scripture before reaching our conclusion on doctrine.

Welcome to the forum Mailmandan. It is good to have you here.

 

[mailmandan]

Welcome to the forum Mailmandan. It is good to have you here.

Hello and thank you for the welcome.

 

[Mr GLee]

"Faith to faith" does not mean "face to face". And broaden your understanding of "person". It is more than a human. It designates a type of being as personal. What that means is it is an entity that relates to and interacts with things. In the case of God, it means that he is a being that speaks and acts, creates and governs that creation, and by his own initiative and doing has a personal relationship with humanity.

Without parable the signified understanding or figurative understanding Christ spoke not . Not spoke good stories sometimes

I would ask then what does the metptphor "face to face" mean and how does it differ then "faith to faith"?

Face to whose face? Faith to whose faith ?

1 Corinthians 13:12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

Genesis 32:30 And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved.

Exodus 33:11 And the Lord spake unto Moses face to face, as a man speaketh unto his friend. And he turned again into the camp: but his servant Joshua, the son of Nun, a young man, departed not out of the tabernacle.

Why did Moses hide his face form the unbelievers?

Numbers 14:14
And they will tell it to the inhabitants of this land: for they have heard that thou Lord art among this people, that thou Lord art seen face to face, and that thy cloud standeth over them, and that thou goest before them, by day time in a pillar of a cloud, and in a pillar of fire by night.

Deuteronomy 5:4
The Lord talked with you face to face in the mount out of the midst of the fire,

Deuteronomy 34:10 And there arose not a prophet since in Israel like unto Moses, whom the Lord knew face to face,

Judges 6:22 And when Gideon perceived that he was an angel of the Lord, Gideon said, Alas, O Lord God! for because I have seen an angel of the Lord face to face.

2 John 1:12Having many things to write unto you, I would not write with paper and ink: but I trust to come unto you, and speak face to face, that our joy may be full.

3 John 1:14 But I trust I shall shortly see thee, and we shall speak face to face. Peace be to thee. Our friends salute thee. Greet the friends by name.

2 Corinthians 4:6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.. . .(face to face reveled knowledge


Question does eternal God have a literal flesh and blood face ?

If so what is the purpose of a theophany like that of Melchisdek?

 

[Mr GLee]

Does the Bible set it's own rules for interpretation? Does that line up with the hermeneutic principles?

Dave

Yes self interpreting, walk or understand not by looking at the historical temporal alone but mix with the eternal invisible .

That is why without parable the signified understanding Christ spoke not

Dont' be a parable hater. looked to the signified called hidden manna in Rev 2:17 daily bread)

Revelation 11 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

The whole time period kings in Israel, the abomination of desolation it was used a a parable called a figure the shadows as metaphors used in parable became sight

Many Christians dismiss the 1st century reformation and put more stock in the 15th a carbon copy.

Hebrew 9:8-9The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;

 

[Arial]

Without parable the signified understanding or figurative understanding Christ spoke not . Not spoke good stories sometimes

There is nothing in the post you quoted about parables. Read the rules and stop breaking them.

I would ask then what does the metptphor "face to face" mean and how does it differ then "faith to faith"?

Neither one is a metaphor.

"Face to face" is how we will see him in the consummation of our salvation at Christ's return. 1 Cor 13:12 For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then fact to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I have been fully known.

"Faith to faith" is growing in our knowledge of God and Christ, always by faith from start to finish. Romans 1:17 For in it (the gospel)the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith as it is written: 'But the righteous one will live by faith."

 

[Mr GLee]

There is nothing in the post you quoted about parables. Read the rules and stop breaking them.

Neither one is a metaphor.

"Face to face" is how we will see him in the consummation of our salvation at Christ's return. 1 Cor 13:12 For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then fact to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I have been fully known.

"Faith to faith" is growing in our knowledge of God and Christ, always by faith from start to finish. Romans 1:17 For in it (the gospel)the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith as it is written: 'But the righteous one will live by faith."

Sorry, Not sure how I am breaking ?

Eternal Faith as unseen "Let there be "power and "it was good"

Face to face in the revealed knowledge?

Christ calling us ye of little faith (power) not a rebuke but rather a fact. More than enough to please

He poured out his Spirit life in jeapordy of his own Holy Spirit on dying fresh .

When the load is increased the strength of Christ does it work to "both" hear and empower to do the will of the Holy Father (Christ)

Luke 17:5 And the apostles said unto the Lord, Increase our (new born-again) faith.