Did God Create Evil?

[makesends]

Yeah, I've had this debate a thousand times and outside of my vent, I don't intend to engage in it here or at all anymore if I can help it. And frankly, because I think its a lost cause. And I apologize for any offence, my desire is absolutely for unity.. but, there is so much pressing heresy in the world, "Torahists" being head of the leaderboard now, the I just don't have the heart for debating this error any longer. It's one of the ones that's so evidently error, that I barely have the patience for it. And again, I won't throw out the "Manichaeism" trope, because of course I'm not 'Arminian", however, if one can't admit the 'Fatalism", elements of Docetism and "Meticulous Determinism" in their philosophy, and recognize it AS philosophy, and know it's roots then we're not having an honest discussion. It's flagrant error. The prooftexts ALL fall. Some make it out, many don't.

I honestly don't know if you're not aware that not all of us come up with what we believe by the route(s) you seem to think we do. While I agree, for example, that meticulous determinism is philosophy, or, at least, the result of reasoning, it remains nevertheless logical (to my mind, anyway). But then, I don't mean by it what others claim it means, so, there's that. But I have not been trained by anyone in Reformed Theology as such, nor in philosophy as such, but pretty much "on my own" agonizing over a life that does not add up to what the Bible says combined with what the believers I knew, trusted and loved taught me (I'm a missionary kid). I'm sorry, but they were wrong. My eternity does not hinge on my silly decision.

I have no idea what leaderboard you're talking about, nor who the "Torahists" are, if they are among the staff here. I've heard no such teaching from them.

God is indeed love, and goodness is what it is because God is good, and that is the correct order of reasoning. If God does something it is good. God does not do moral evil, I agree. He is altogether himself, and does not (it is illogical to say that he does) work against himself, which is a pretty good definition for moral evil. But what he did was, as First Cause, create everything else. If moral evil/sin counts as "a thing", he at the very least, intentionally caused that it be. It did not come about by chance or by accident. "Libertarian free will" is necessarily accidental.

Scripture bears me out, and through scripture is how I found what I did. (No, I don't claim there is no bias in my use of Scripture, but early on my bias did everything it could to support my Arminianism, Wesleyanism, Billy Graham-ism, Dispensationalism etc etc --not Reformed theology, not Calvinism.)

 

[ReverendRV]

I apologize Rev for setting a contentious tone, not my goal. To me, that verse is simply parsed, and it's frustrating that That one in particular is used incessantly by atheists and other enemies of God, and to have to field it from brothers as well, it gets wearisome. But yeah, that one is one of the perennial "hits".

Atheists don't understand that God Surreptitiously Creates Evil; just by being God...

All's good. I can Debate all day long with someone who will talk things out...

 

[ReverendRV]

I honestly don't know if you're not aware that not all of us come up with what we believe by the route(s) you seem to think we do. While I agree, for example, that meticulous determinism is philosophy, or, at least, the result of reasoning, it remains nevertheless logical (to my mind, anyway). But then, I don't mean by it what others claim it means, so, there's that. But I have not been trained by anyone in Reformed Theology as such, nor in philosophy as such, but pretty much "on my own" agonizing over a life that does not add up to what the Bible says combined with what the believers I knew, trusted and loved taught me (I'm a missionary kid). I'm sorry, but they were wrong. My eternity does not hinge on my silly decision.

I have no idea what leaderboard you're talking about, nor who the "Torahists" are, if they are among the staff here. I've heard no such teaching from them.

God is indeed love, and goodness is what it is because God is good, and that is the correct order of reasoning. If God does something it is good. God does not do moral evil, I agree. He is altogether himself, and does not (it is illogical to say that he does) work against himself, which is a pretty good definition for moral evil. But what he did was, as First Cause, create everything else. If moral evil/sin counts as "a thing", he at the very least, intentionally caused that it be. It did not come about by chance or by accident. "Libertarian free will" is necessarily accidental.

Scripture bears me out, and through scripture is how I found what I did. (No, I don't claim there is no bias in my use of Scripture, but early on my bias did everything it could to support my Arminianism, Wesleyanism, Billy Graham-ism, Dispensationalism etc etc --not Reformed theology, not Calvinism.)

God is Love; God is Good...

But that's not THE Prime Hermeneutic...

The Prime Hermeneutic is Sola Scriptura. This may help him understand Reformed Christians. To Us, "God is Love"; is just one of many Hermeneutic principles...

 

[brightfame52]

Did God Create Evil?​

Yes, since He purposed its existence for His Eternal Purpose in Christ. Eph 3:10-11

10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

Ps 104:24

O Lord, how manifold are thy works! in wisdom hast thou made them all: the earth is full of thy riches.

Prov 3 19

The Lord by wisdom hath founded the earth; by understanding hath he established the heavens.

 

[Arial]

Yes, since He purposed its existence for His Eternal Purpose in Christ. Eph 3:10-11

10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

Ps 104:24

O Lord, how manifold are thy works! in wisdom hast thou made them all: the earth is full of thy riches.

Prov 3 19

The Lord by wisdom hath founded the earth; by understanding hath he established the heavens.

Evil isn't created. It is simply the other side of the coin. Anything that opposes God who is good and perfect and holy, is evil. Therefore, unregenerate man is evil in the eyes of God, and they do evil things. God uses this evil to accomplish his purposes. His purpose is stated Isa. 11 and Rev 21. The utter destruction of the source of evil and evil itself.

Impossible to imagine, but a breathtaking hope (certainty).