• **Notifications**: Notifications can be dismissed by clicking on the "x" on the righthand side of the notice.
  • **New Style**: You can now change style options. Click on the paintbrush at the bottom of this page.
  • **Donations**: If the Lord leads you please consider helping with monthly costs and up keep on our Forum. Click on the Donate link In the top menu bar. Thanks
  • **New Blog section**: There is now a blog section. Check it out near the Private Debates forum or click on the Blog link in the top menu bar.
  • Welcome Visitors! Join us and be blessed while fellowshipping and celebrating our Glorious Salvation In Christ Jesus.

3 Passages That Organize the Biblical Message

We must, therefore, consider the first three chapters of Genesis critical, organizing and defining.
I would agree the three chapters set the standard as a foundation in respect to the born again seed. . which is later used in regard to the word Abraham. It having nothing to do with his dying flesh .

The word Judaism seemed to be used quite often. It does not seem to be a phrase used in the Bible . Is there more than one way to use the word Judaism? Who defines it?
 
In 3:17 someone is treating the law as though it voided and replaced the promise. It is against reality to do so, but Judaism was doing so.
It doesn't say that anyone was doing that, but rather it says that Paul was giving an example.

Treat yourself to some punctuation and simplify your sentences! Most of what you said I agree with but it is sideways to my topic.

In this thread, there is something 1st cent Judaism did in 3 ways against what was in its own scripture. In the Gal 3 case , it was to void the promise by the law, against reality.

In Rom 9-10 it was to establish its own righteousness, not one by faith in Christ.

In Eph 3 it was to seek a unity of Jew and gentile through the law, not through the gospel.

There is a verb in Gen 15 about ‘reading’ or ‘calculating’ the stars that is a play on God ‘crediting’ righteousness to Abraham. It is separate from the counting of the number, but Gal 3 tells us it is only the one Seed , Christ, that is important for this, bc the big multiple is through Him.

God was having Abraham look forward to what the stars would say in the future—Christs day, Jn 8. A king savior would be born in Israel, the same person met in ch 14, a king-priest of Jerusalem.
In Romans 9-10, they misunderstood the goal of the law by think that obeying it was about establishing their own righteousness rather than about knowing Christ. In Matthew 4:15-23, repenting from our disobedience to God's law is a central part of the Gospel. Indeed, while the promise is in regard to one Seed who was sent to bless us by turning us from our wickedness, we can inherit that promise through faith by being sent for the same purpose, which is why Abraham looked forward to Christ by turning the nations from their wickedness in accordance with the promise and the Gospel of the Kingdom that was made known in advance to him, which was how his seed was multiplied (Galatians 3:8).
 
It doesn't say that anyone was doing that, but rather it says that Paul was giving an example.


In Romans 9-10, they misunderstood the goal of the law by think that obeying it was about establishing their own righteousness rather than about knowing Christ. In Matthew 4:15-23, repenting from our disobedience to God's law is a central part of the Gospel. Indeed, while the promise is in regard to one Seed who was sent to bless us by turning us from our wickedness, we can inherit that promise through faith by being sent for the same purpose, which is why Abraham looked forward to Christ by turning the nations from their wickedness in accordance with the promise and the Gospel of the Kingdom that was made known in advance to him, which was how his seed was multiplied (Galatians 3:8).
If you read the NT historically instead of for direct application , you can see who was voiding and replacing the promise. Paul had first hand experience doing this before he was a believer.

If no one was doing it, why mention it—a problem that isn’t being done?

I suggest shorter sentences.
 
If you read the NT historically instead of for direct application , you can see who was voiding and replacing the promise. Paul had first hand experience doing this before he was a believer.

If no one was doing it, why mention it—a problem that isn’t being done?

I suggest shorter sentences.
The verses does not say anything about anyone voiding and replacing the promise. Paul was saying that the law does not nullify the promise of a covenant that has already been ratified in order to make the point that the promise is inherited through faith rather than earned.
 
The verses does not say anything about anyone voiding and replacing the promise. Paul was saying that the law does not nullify the promise of a covenant that has already been ratified in order to make the point that the promise is inherited through faith rather than earned.

So he is addressing a non issue—something no one thinks. Way to go Paul. No, he was doing that as taught by Judaism.
 
I would agree the three chapters set the standard as a foundation in respect to the born again seed. . which is later used in regard to the word Abraham. It having nothing to do with his dying flesh .
The salient point I was endeavoring to make is that I do not know how anyone can cite "organizing" texts ignoring the beginning. Assuming there is a rational rationale for that neglect, I'd like to know how and why that was not done.
The word Judaism seemed to be used quite often. It does not seem to be a phrase used in the Bible . Is there more than one way to use the word Judaism? Who defines it?
When I use it I mean the religion. Judaism, Christianity, Islam. Religions. I use "Tanakh" to separate the "Jewish" scriptures from the religion. You've probably read me say something like, "Tanakh is always correct, but Judaism was often incorrect," more than once. Sometimes I'll say "the Old Testament" but that misses the point there are not two testaments for Judaism and focuses the separation on the Jewish religion, Judaism. For Christians, we use the language of "Old..." and "New...," but we also view the two as parts of a whole (with varying degrees of contiguity and continuity, depending on one's theological and doctrinal affiliations).

It's relevant to this op because this op asserts small portions of larger narratives in three epistles are "organizing" of the whole Bible AND implicitly starts with eschatology. In other words, the end, end times, are supposedly organizing the whole Bible AND it does so absent ay beginning text. The unwritten premise is the end times define the whole in neglect of the beginning.

I disagree.

I disagree on two counts. First the Bible is not about us. It is about Jesus. Second, if we're going to consider one doctrine a doctrine that organizes the whole then it would be soteriology, not eschatology. Eschatology is a subset of Soteriology (which, in turn, is a subset of Theology (the doctrine of God). Normally, the only ones who elevate eschatology above soteriology are the Dispensationalists but I do not recall @EarlyActs being a dispy (my recall may be wanting), so I'm curious how these matters are explained.
 
The salient point I was endeavoring to make is that I do not know how anyone can cite "organizing" texts ignoring the beginning. Assuming there is a rational rationale for that neglect, I'd like to know how and why that was not done.

When I use it I mean the religion. Judaism, Christianity, Islam. Religions. I use "Tanakh" to separate the "Jewish" scriptures from the religion. You've probably read me say something like, "Tanakh is always correct, but Judaism was often incorrect," more than once. Sometimes I'll say "the Old Testament" but that misses the point there are not two testaments for Judaism and focuses the separation on the Jewish religion, Judaism. For Christians, we use the language of "Old..." and "New...," but we also view the two as parts of a whole (with varying degrees of contiguity and continuity, depending on one's theological and doctrinal affiliations).

It's relevant to this op because this op asserts small portions of larger narratives in three epistles are "organizing" of the whole Bible AND implicitly starts with eschatology. In other words, the end, end times, are supposedly organizing the whole Bible AND it does so absent ay beginning text. The unwritten premise is the end times define the whole in neglect of the beginning.

I disagree.

I disagree on two counts. First the Bible is not about us. It is about Jesus. Second, if we're going to consider one doctrine a doctrine that organizes the whole then it would be soteriology, not eschatology. Eschatology is a subset of Soteriology (which, in turn, is a subset of Theology (the doctrine of God). Normally, the only ones who elevate eschatology above soteriology are the Dispensationalists but I do not recall @EarlyActs being a dispy (my recall may be wanting), so I'm curious how these matters are explained.
In one way we receive the end of our new born again faith from the beginning with the confidence of Christ spoken of in Philippian1:6 in so much if he has began the good teaching ,comforting and guiding work in us he will finish it til our last days , All receive the same reward eternal life of the Holy Father .

The eschatology. . . things past, things present, things future All the work of God was finished in the six days he did work. Amil the signified tongue or figure of speech of parables given in the opening of the book or chapter

Revelation 1King James Version1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
 
In one way we receive the end of our new born again faith from the beginning with the confidence of Christ spoken of in Philippian1:6 in so much if he has began the good teaching ,comforting and guiding work in us he will finish it til our last days , All receive the same reward eternal life of the Holy Father .

The eschatology. . . things past, things present, things future All the work of God was finished in the six days he did work. Amil the signified tongue or figure of speech of parables given in the opening of the book or chapter

Revelation 1King James Version1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
Relevance to the op?
 
I disagree on two counts. First the Bible is not about us. It is about Jesus. Second, if we're going to consider one doctrine a doctrine that organizes the whole then it would be soteriology, not eschatology. Eschatology is a subset of Soteriology (which, in turn, is a subset of Theology (the doctrine of God). Normally, the only ones who elevate eschatology above soteriology are the Dispensationalists but I do not recall @EarlyActs being a dispy (my recall may be wanting), so I'm curious how these matters are explained.
Perhaps I am not understanding your point using the words eschatology and soteriology?

What is meant that it's not about us but is in respect to the words of Christ .That would seem obvious.?

Are you saying before we can give a accurate understanding of the end of all things a person must first study how salvation works?

Why is it necessary to place one before the other and not all together as one lesson ?
 
Perhaps I am not understanding your point using the words eschatology and soteriology?

What is meant that it's not about us but is in respect to the words of Christ .That would seem obvious.?

Are you saying before we can give a accurate understanding of the end of all things a person must first study how salvation works?

Why is it necessary to place one before the other and not all together as one lesson ?
Yes!

It is impossible to have a correct understanding of eschatology without a correct understanding of soteriology. Christ is pre-existent. He is before all things and by him, through him, and for him were all things created. There is no end times apart from Jesus!

And this is very, very important because Dispensationalism has turned this on its head. They openly emphasize ecclesiology and eschatology above soteriology and thereby pervert Christology. In turn, because of the popularity of Premillennial Dispensational eschatology we've all be adversely influenced..... unless we stick to scripture and not popular doctrine.

What happens on the last day?
 
Yes!

It is impossible to have a correct understanding of eschatology without a correct understanding of soteriology. Christ is pre-existent. He is before all things and by him, through him, and for him were all things created. There is no end times apart from Jesus!

And this is very, very important because Dispensationalism has turned this on its head. They openly emphasize ecclesiology and eschatology above soteriology and thereby pervert Christology. In turn, because of the popularity of Premillennial Dispensational eschatology we've all be adversely influenced..... unless we stick to scripture and not popular doctrine.

What happens on the last day?

I would think we are given the understanding of our new born again faith. . as the end his understanding of His faith or labor of love. receiving that understanding from the beginning. Him empowering us to believe in God not seen. Our first love. Using Creation to introduce the presence of God who is light ,(let there be God/Light and it was good alone good ) . Who is also Spirit and Love. And not that he can only create light temporarily (under the sun)

On the last day Christ who is reigning in the hearts of those born again. His presence will leave like a thief in the night. Then like in the beginning (first three days) God who is light will again be the light of the whole world there will be no darkness as night .The Sun and Moon the two witnesses God has spoken have come to the end of time. . On the last day. A picture of Christ meeting his wife the church and she receives the new body that will never die.The Sun and moon will no longer be needed . In the way of showing the end from the beginning. No signs to wonder after believer have prophecy

Our born again faith, God revealing his understanding in our new hearts he gives us little of his faith calling us ye of little faith .

1 Petyr 1:7-11 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ: Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory: Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls. Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you: Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

They looked ahead we by the same Spirit of Christ that works in us we can look back No signs were given to wonder after.

A parable that speaks of Christ our husband coming down to consummate the the wedding ceremony on the last day.

Psalm 19 King James Version19 The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork. Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge.3 There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard.4 Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun Which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, and rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race.His going forth is from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof.7 The law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple. . (bride)
 
I would think we are given the understanding of our new born again faith. . as the end his understanding of His faith or labor of love. receiving that understanding from the beginning. Him empowering us to believe in God not seen. Our first love................
Relevance?
 
Back
Top