• **Notifications**: Notifications can be dismissed by clicking on the "x" on the righthand side of the notice.
  • **New Style**: You can now change style options. Click on the paintbrush at the bottom of this page.
  • **Donations**: If the Lord leads you please consider helping with monthly costs and up keep on our Forum. Click on the Donate link In the top menu bar. Thanks
  • **New Blog section**: There is now a blog section. Check it out near the Private Debates forum or click on the Blog link in the top menu bar.
  • Welcome Visitors! Join us and be blessed while fellowshipping and celebrating our Glorious Salvation In Christ Jesus.

SWEET TASTE OF FREEDOM FROM THE MODERN CHURCH

Buff Scott Jr.

Sophomore
Joined
Jul 31, 2023
Messages
421
Reaction score
131
Points
43
The Sweet Taste of Freedom From the
Ultra-Modern Church




“Buff, I just recently became part of your mailing list and have a question on today’s Rumblings. As I understand it, you are not part of any gathering of Christians outside your family. This concerns me. How are you connected to the Body of Christ? How are you connected to Jesus and His bride, the church?”—Tim.​

<><><>
As a defector of the modern church, our meetings are house assemblies and composed of both family and friends, as were the assemblies of the early believers. As to my being connected to the body of Christ, if I met only with myself, or if I were to find myself deserted on some far-away island, Id still be part of the body of believers and part of Jesus bride—namely, the congregation of the redeemed.

Just because I am not aligned with some religious party, church, sect, or denomination does not invalidate the fact that when I experienced the new birth, I was joined to every believer within the family of faith. We must crucify the idea that unless we are members of a church we are separated from Jesus and what He founded. This concept is divisive and sectarian, all the way to the bone and back.

Rubel Shelly once said, “I just want to be a Christian, but ‘the church’ won’t let me.” Rubel was a well-known author and preacher. And thats the history of churchly-addicted believers. Generally speaking, the local church will not permit anyone of their brand and within their corral to be a Christian only. You either wear their brand and adopt their agenda or youre disinherited—not by the Lord, but by those who feel they have aready arrived.

Jesus said it best when He announced on two different occasions, “I have other sheep that are not of this fold,” and “I have many in this city who are my people” (John 10:16 & Acts 18:10).

The late Edward Fudge hit the target when he wrote, “The vision of a community of disciples is also obscured today by the almost-exclusive use of the term ‘church’—a word which in much modern usage hides the individual within the group, replaces interdependent relationships with static membership in an institution, and loses much of the sense of personal commitment, allegiance, and responsiveness to Jesus Himself as Master and Teacher.” Amen!

We can serve others better when we are free of all partisan fetters, and that is because we don’t have to look over our shoulders to see if our party’s chieftains are looking our way. The free man in Christ does not nor cannot represent any church, faction, denomination, or cult upon the face of this earth. He is God’s representative. He answers only to his Lord, not to the “chief priests and teachers of the law.” He has no earthen lords, popes, or masters to whom he must give account.

If I might describe such a man, he is bold but not violent, firm but not rude, outspoken but not mouthy. The free man will be compassionate and loving. He will always remember that a man called Jesus transformed the world without throwing a rock, burning a building, drawing a sword, or brainwashing weak and innocent minds. This man Jesus changed the world by the simple act of persuasive teaching. There will never be another like Him. Praise His Holy Name!
 
Hi @Buff Scott Jr.,

Is this op intended to be an off shoot of the house Church model?

Do you, personally, feel handicapped, or otherwise prevented from practicing your faith by the congregation you attend (and its leaders)?
 
Hi @Buff Scott Jr.,

Is this op intended to be an off shoot of the house Church model?

Do you, personally, feel handicapped, or otherwise prevented from practicing your faith by the congregation you attend (and its leaders)?
Yes, perhaps an off-shoot. As to "the congregation I attend," here is what I post at the closing of each of my columns...
This weekly column is “My Cyber-Space Assembly.” Thank you for being one of the many participants as we mutually enlighten each other. Each week my audience and I meet here. Two of our main thrusts are Reformation and Unity within the Christian community.—Buff.​
 
One of my personal convictions is being a "lone ranger Christian".

Having been a loner my entire life, it has crept it way into my Christian life.

I know about a handful of (4) Christians outside of this forum. That would be my siblings and their spouses.

Over the last 20 years I have tried being in many different churches and my "flesh" gets the best of me or their doctrines do not align with my belief or the modern music or.......

I have read that 'home churches" are more common in this age.

Deep down I am convicted of not being part of a church setting because I am not in fellowship or using my gifts to minister to others.

The flesh is an ugly thing.

Forgive me for going off topic but reading the OP brought these things to my mind.
 
One of my personal convictions is being a "lone ranger Christian".

Having been a loner my entire life, it has crept it way into my Christian life.

I know about a handful of (4) Christians outside of this forum. That would be my siblings and their spouses.

Over the last 20 years I have tried being in many different churches and my "flesh" gets the best of me or their doctrines do not align with my belief or the modern music or.......

I have read that 'home churches" are more common in this age.

Deep down I am convicted of not being part of a church setting because I am not in fellowship or using my gifts to minister to others.

The flesh is an ugly thing.

Forgive me for going off topic but reading the OP brought these things to my mind.
Stay in there, brother, and keep in contact.
 
Just because I am not aligned with some religious party, church, sect, or denomination
If you don't want to go to church...Personally I really don't care. That's up to you.

Maybe I got you wrong...but not all "modern" churches fit the picture you paint.

Whether John 10:16 & Acts 18:10 speak of the same topic...I doubt it.

Heb 10:23 Let us hold resolutely to the hope we profess, for He who promised is faithful. 24 And let us consider how to spur one another on to love and good deeds. 25 Let us not neglect meeting together, as some have made a habit, but let us encourage one another, and all the more as you see the Day approaching.....A "house church" or a "modern church" should not neglect meeting together.
 
Yes, perhaps an off-shoot. As to "the congregation I attend," here is what I post at the closing of each of my columns...
This weekly column is “My Cyber-Space Assembly.” Thank you for being one of the many participants as we mutually enlighten each other. Each week my audience and I meet here. Two of our main thrusts are Reformation and Unity within the Christian community.—Buff.​
I'm curious about Mr. Shelly's comments about the Church not letting him be a Christian. I wonder about the comment because I, for one, do not have any problem whatsoever being a Christian and I currently congregate with a PCA congregation (which are generally decided in their doctrine and, thereby, what passes for appropriate conduct for a Christian. I'm also curious about the house church aspect because every congregation of which I have been a member for the last 40+ years has small groups that meet in individual's homes, replicating the house church model inside the larger (non-)denominational organization setting. In other words, it is possible to have both models simultaneously. Third, I'm also curious because as I was reading through the op the first time it sounded very much like the Church-criticizing ragging that has become a mainstay since the Restoration Movement in the 19th century, especially among modern futurists (who use the corruption of the Church as an integral part of the ecclesiology supporting their modern futurism. I do not know that either Shelly or Fudge are Dispensationalist, but the Church-ragging sounds like what I hear from the Dispies.

As a fellow annihilationist myself, I know something of Fudge's views, but I don't know that we share much outside the matter of conditional mortality. Shelly, coming from the CoC pov is a classic restorationist and a I do not think I have ever read/heard him repudiate the CoC pov, or the organization. I, therefore, wonder if when he says the Church won't let him be a Christian does he mean the CoC won't let him be a Christian, or the Church won't let him be a CoC Christian, or the entire body of Christ (because, scripturally speaking, there is only one Church) won't let him be a member of Christ's body.



Your thoughts on any of the above?
 
If you don't want to go to church...Personally I really don't care. That's up to you.

Maybe I got you wrong...but not all "modern" churches fit the picture you paint.

Whether John 10:16 & Acts 18:10 speak of the same topic...I doubt it.

Heb 10:23 Let us hold resolutely to the hope we profess, for He who promised is faithful. 24 And let us consider how to spur one another on to love and good deeds. 25 Let us not neglect meeting together, as some have made a habit, but let us encourage one another, and all the more as you see the Day approaching.....A "house church" or a "modern church" should not neglect meeting together.
Nor did I indicate that all modern-day churches fit the picture I painted. But generally speaking, the vast majority do.​
 
I'm curious about Mr. Shelly's comments about the Church not letting him be a Christian. I wonder about the comment because I, for one, do not have any problem whatsoever being a Christian and I currently congregate with a PCA congregation (which are generally decided in their doctrine and, thereby, what passes for appropriate conduct for a Christian. I'm also curious about the house church aspect because every congregation of which I have been a member for the last 40+ years has small groups that meet in individual's homes, replicating the house church model inside the larger (non-)denominational organization setting. In other words, it is possible to have both models simultaneously. Third, I'm also curious because as I was reading through the op the first time it sounded very much like the Church-criticizing ragging that has become a mainstay since the Restoration Movement in the 19th century, especially among modern futurists (who use the corruption of the Church as an integral part of the ecclesiology supporting their modern futurism. I do not know that either Shelly or Fudge are Dispensationalist, but the Church-ragging sounds like what I hear from the Dispies.

As a fellow annihilationist myself, I know something of Fudge's views, but I don't know that we share much outside the matter of conditional mortality. Shelly, coming from the CoC pov is a classic restorationist and a I do not think I have ever read/heard him repudiate the CoC pov, or the organization. I, therefore, wonder if when he says the Church won't let him be a Christian does he mean the CoC won't let him be a Christian, or the Church won't let him be a CoC Christian, or the entire body of Christ (because, scripturally speaking, there is only one Church) won't let him be a member of Christ's body.



Your thoughts on any of the above?
I'm listening and reading you. May or may not agree with all you express.
 
Nor did I indicate that all modern-day churches fit the picture I painted. But generally speaking, the vast majority do.​
I pretty much disagree.

The problems with the concept of a home church creeps in when "home pastors" begin to preach errors. It becomes easy for them to become legalistic and cult like.
When the biblically uneducated like Joseph Smith teach their ridiculous home church ideas....major errors easily follow.

Keep in mind I'm not saying a home based church is doomed to fail.

I do have a problem with some of the modern day mega churchs. Especially the name it and claim it brand.
 
I personally believe the vast majority of modern-day churches are apostate with teachings abandoning the sovereignty of God for the sovereignty of man, easy salvation such as on your work of a “magic prayer”, little to no teaching of sanctification following salvation, and other teachings.

I would argue that Christ has removed Himself (the “Candlestick”/Rev 2:5) from the churches for not keeping proper teachings and behavior as directed by scripture and has been overwhelmingly replaced by the angel of light described in 2 Cor 11:14-15.

I stopped going to church over 10 years ago and have grown immensely closer to God by avoiding all contemporary Christianity. The sin strongholds I was never able to break finally fell away, I’ve learned so much more personally studying the Bible and listening to works of old dead preachers from a 100 years ago+ on YouTube and other sites. I have not forsaken the gathering of the saints; I still gather with them daily before the throne of God in prayers.
 
I pretty much disagree.

The problems with the concept of a home church creeps in when "home pastors" begin to preach errors. It becomes easy for them to become legalistic and cult like.
When the biblically uneducated like Joseph Smith teach their ridiculous home church ideas....major errors easily follow.

Keep in mind I'm not saying a home based church is doomed to fail.

I do have a problem with some of the modern day mega churchs. Especially the name it and claim it brand.
Don't forget that the early believers met in home assemblies, and some of the problems you mention above existed in those early home assemblies, too, such as Corinth. Where there are humans, there will be problems - anywhere, everywhere.​
 
I personally believe the vast majority of modern-day churches are apostate with teachings abandoning the sovereignty of God for the sovereignty of man, easy salvation such as on your work of a “magic prayer”, little to no teaching of sanctification following salvation, and other teachings.

I would argue that Christ has removed Himself (the “Candlestick”/Rev 2:5) from the churches for not keeping proper teachings and behavior as directed by scripture and has been overwhelmingly replaced by the angel of light described in 2 Cor 11:14-15.

I stopped going to church over 10 years ago and have grown immensely closer to God by avoiding all contemporary Christianity. The sin strongholds I was never able to break finally fell away, I’ve learned so much more personally studying the Bible and listening to works of old dead preachers from a 100 years ago+ on YouTube and other sites. I have not forsaken the gathering of the saints; I still gather with them daily before the throne of God in prayers.
Your input is appreciated, brother. But I would suggest you start a home assembly, the model practiced by the early believers. I have home assemblies in my home. We converse, we love, we even disagree on occasions. Mutual love is the vital factor.​
 
Don't forget that the early believers met in home assemblies, and some of the problems you mention above existed in those early home assemblies, too, such as Corinth. Where there are humans, there will be problems - anywhere, everywhere.​
Many churches today have started out in homes.

I have no problem with home churches. I simply presented a warning about some.
 
Back
Top