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Arminianism

Carbon

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Is the Arminian system a Christian system?

I personally do not believe it is.
Before anyone starts throwing stones; I am not saying Arminians are not christians.
I’m just talking about the ststem,

Thoughts?
 
That is going to depend directly on what it means for a system to be Christian—or what makes a system non-Christian.

A system that purports to be Christian but is actually not, I think, would be a heretical system. In his book Heresies (1984), Harold Brown said that heresy doesn't refer to simply any doctrinal disagreement but to something that could undercut or threaten the very integrity of the Christian faith. With that understanding in mind, would you still describe Arminian theology as not Christian? If so, what specifically undercuts or threatens the very integrity of the Christian faith? And what other ostensibly Christian groups would that effectively disenfranchise (e.g., Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, etc.)?

Harold Brown, Heresies: The Image of Christ in the Mirror of Heresy and Orthodoxy from the Apostles to the Present (Garden City, NY: Doubleday, 1984), p. 15.
 
Is the Arminian system a Christian system?

I personally do not believe it is.
Before anyone starts throwing stones; I am not saying Arminians are not christians.
I’m just talking about the ststem,

Thoughts?
What Christian denomination, sect, organization, system, etc. teaches Arminianism? I think there are indeed Christian organizations that would agree with some, or all, of the precepts put forth by Jacobus Arminius in his refutation of the teaching of John Calvin. However, I am not aware of any that proclaim an adherence to Arminianism as the guiding doctrine. I have never heard or read of anyone promoting Jacobus Arminius as a guiding theologian; in fact, the typical reference to Arminianism is from a Calvinist arguing against it.

There is a topic here, "What type of Calvinist am I?" I doubt that you would ever find a topic, "What type of Arminianist am I?", in any other forum. Personally, I have never, that I remember, ever addressed the subject of Calvinism vs Arminianism. I have addressed the subject of Calvinism vs non-Calvinism. But perhaps that is just me, nit picking.
 
Is the Arminian system a Christian system?

Arminianism​

Arminianism essentially is a complete system of conditional salvation based upon man using inherent ability to perform conditions for it.

It is not improperly called theistic humanism – it glorifies man as the determiner of his destiny and yet tries to glorify God as well.

God is limited by man’s concept of fairness: man is a very capable creature still, and he must be in total control of his destiny.

It begins with human rationalization about God that is comforting to the flesh rather than with God’s own revelation of Himself.

In general, this is a very palatable theology, in that it makes man precious, God uncontrollably in love, and salvation for the taking.

Arminianism will degenerate to modernism or other heresies, for God is lenient, and the need to save the lost justifies any means.

Arminianism began with Satan’s lie in the Garden of Eden to Adam and Eve, which contradicted God’s revelation and damned the race. In defiance and denial of God’s revelation, Satan convinced Eve that she would not surely die if she ate of the fruit (Genesis 3:1-4). Satan convinced her that she could sacramentally become just like God by her own personal act in taking the fruit (Genesis 3:5-6). Consider that Armininians today still try to peddle the lie that man is not dead by his sin in Eden, just like the father Arminianism, the devil. Adam and Eve, just like Arminians today, sewed fig leaves together in their own vain attempt to cover their terrible sin (Gen 3:7). It showed itself in the New Testament with proud Jews and skeptical Greeks (Luk 4:25-29; John 6:64-66; 8:33-34; Rom 3:5,8; 9:14,19).

Pelagius, a Welsh monk, began the systematic spread of Pelagianism, an early version of Arminianism, around the early 400’s. He denied original sin, a depraved nature, representation by either Adam or Christ, and the need for special grace to be saved. He held the innocence of human children, man’s freedom of will, and the possibility of achieving perfection in this life.

The Roman Catholics declared very Arminian principles at the Council of Trent in 1546 i.e. maintaining freewill and sacramentalism. Read the anathemas pronounced in the Sixth Session of Trent against God’s grace in salvation and the freewill of man. Google and read for yourself.

Augustus Toplady, the author of the hymn “Rock of Ages,” exposed the close connection of Arminianism to Rome. Google and read for yourself.

James Arminius (1560-1609) began the systematic spread of Arminianism in the early 1600s, as he rebelled against state Calvinism. As a university professor in Leiden, Arminius questioned Calvin’s theology in several points, publishing and preaching against it. Not that we fully agree with John Calvin, he brought some error out with him from the great whore ~ even though a great man of God no doubt.

In 1610, his followers issued a remonstrance to the government of Holland against the Calvinistic doctrine of the state church. Man is not so corrupted by sin that he is unable to cooperate with God in performing conditions for his salvation to eternal life. Man’s election to salvation is conditional upon God forseeing his faith and perseverance and confirming him thereby to eternal life. Jesus Christ’s death potentially provided for the salvation of all men upon conditions, but it did not surely secure salvation for any. Man is able to resist the work of the Holy Spirit in applying the effects of Christ’s death to men, as salvation is only an offer. The conditions for final salvation include continuing in faith and good works until death, for sin will cause you to lose salvation.

A sum of Arminianism~so, no it is not biblical, thereforth, not Christian, Yet, some of God children are with the walls of Arminianism, that need to flee them. Arminianism is another gospel, that God pronounces a curse upon. My grandmother died believing this lie, yet displayed fruits of a child of God just as many do today~so, we do not question anyone's salvation from sin and condemnation based on their knowledge of the scriptures~the curse is more upon those who preach this lie~Paul prayed that they would be cut off, Galatians 5:12~" would they were even cut off which trouble you." Too hard? NO!
 
Is the Arminian system a Christian system?

I personally do not believe it is.
Before anyone starts throwing stones; I am not saying Arminians are not christians.
I’m just talking about the ststem,

Thoughts?
There's only one Christian system. To be led of the Spirit believing the truth. Anything that is not of the truth is not of Christ. So unless you're prepared to say that everything you believe is absolutely true and you are in no need of correction? There is always the possibilty that all of us are following a system that is not Christian in some part of our lives.
 
There's only one Christian system. To be led of the Spirit believing the truth. Anything that is not of the truth is not of Christ. So unless you're prepared to say that everything you believe is absolutely true and you are in no need of correction? There is always the possibilty that all of us are following a system that is not Christian in some part of our lives.
How can one be a Christian if he adheres to a system that is not a Christian system?
 

Arminianism​



A sum of Arminianism~so, no it is not biblical, thereforth, not Christian,
Thus, you are saying any system that does not follow your (Calvinist) interpretation of Scripture is non-Christian. Nothing egocentric there at all! LOL
 
Thus, you are saying any system that does not follow your (Calvinist) interpretation of Scripture is non-Christian. Nothing egocentric there at all! LOL
Jim, I did not say those words, those are your words. First of all I'm not A Calvinist in the sense of what is known as Calvinism. You and I have been over this many times before.

There are children of God on both aisle of this spectrum. I even said that above, in so many words.
 
How can one be a Christian if he adheres to a system that is not a Christian system?
Jim, let say a person can be born of God, yet in error ~ A Christian maybe would be more defined as meaning one who adheres strictly to the teachings of Christ without wavering

None of us are without some errors~we labor to minimize those errors as much as possible while living in this body of sin and death.
 
How can one be a Christian if he adheres to a system that is not a Christian system?
Do you think there are parts of your life that don't need correction? Why do you think we will all stand before the judgement seat of Christ? It is Christ who makes us a Christian. We have been bought at a price. (1Cor.6:20 & 7:23) He has our failings covered, where sin abounds grace abounds even more. Failure to apply the system is not excusable but we are all at different growth stages and it should be recognised and understood we do not always get it right.
 
Why do you think we will all stand before the judgement seat of Christ? I
Since that occurs following the resurrection, that judgment is not about being saved or lost. Salvation is determined before death and resurrection.
 
Jim, let say a person can be born of God, yet in error ~ A Christian maybe would be more defined as meaning one who adheres strictly to the teachings of Christ without wavering
Perhaps I am missing what you are saying there, but that sounds to me like there would be no such thing as a Christian. I have never known anyone who would meet that criterion.
 
Since that occurs following the resurrection, that judgment is not about being saved or lost. Salvation is determined before death and resurrection.
That's right, it's about being evaluated on how we walked in this life. Not all of us will work out how to walk in the system God has supplied us with 100% of the time.

I have understood the OP's question revolving around how we "each work out our salvation", not whether those who disagree with us are unsaved.
 
Do you think there are parts of your life that don't need correction? Why do you think we will all stand before the judgement seat of Christ? It is Christ who makes us a Christian. We have been bought at a price. (1Cor.6:20 & 7:23) He has our failings covered, where sin abounds grace abounds even more. Failure to apply the system is not excusable but we are all at different growth stages and it should be recognised and understood we do not always get it right.
How many other non-Christian systems of belief can one adhere to and be a Christian? How about Islam?
 
How about Islam?
No, that sect has it own god ~Allah, they worship the moon! It is on their flag! Maybe you would too if you lived in the desert and at night got some relief from the moon, and if God hardens one's heart, harden.... I mean leaving them to their own wisdom, by not showing any grace to them.

Jim, there are some Litmus test that we can use to be persuaded if one is of God or not~If a man lives under the power of a known sin, that man is not of God. If a man hates another man regardless what he professes that man is not of God, on and we could go. If a man boldly rejects the deity of Jesus Christ then that man is not of God. Being a little confused and boldly rejecting truth is two different things altogether.
 
I don't think that is what he is saying. I believe one can be RCC and be saved.
So the is the RCC a Chrisian system? If Carbon thinks that Arminianism is not a Christian system, I expect that he thinks the same about the Roman Catholicism. My question stands. How can one adhering to a non-Christan system be a Christian?
 
So the is the RCC a Chrisian system? If Carbon thinks that Arminianism is not a Christian system, I expect that he thinks the same about the Roman Catholicism. My question stands. How can one adhering to a non-Christan system be a Christian?
I would say a errant Christian system. God can save whomever He wants in any system. If a Catholic confesses their sin and Christ as Lord are they still lost because of the ststem they currently adhere to? Systems are man made. Walking in lock step is not what saves you.
 
I would say a errant Christian system. God can save whomever He wants in any system. If a Catholic confesses their sin and Christ as Lord are they still lost because of the ststem they currently adhere to? Systems are man made. Walking in lock step is not what saves you.
An errant Christian system -- so then, you disagree with the opening post? You think Arminianism is a Christian system, albeit an errant Christian system. I could accept that. After all, I think Calvinism is an errant Christan system.
 
An errant Christian system -- so then, you disagree with the opening post? You think Arminianism is a Christian system, albeit an errant Christian system. I could accept that. After all, I think Calvinism is an errant Christan system.
There ya go. I think your in error and you think I am in error. The essentials we agree on however. Hence you are my brother in Christ. Our differences are a in house debate.
 
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